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Rogers getting Sanctioned by Apple?

appleinsider.com — After raising the ire of its customers with what are believed to be overly expensive iPhone 3G plans, Canadian provider Rogers Wireless is allegedly being punished by Apple with fewer shipments.

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  • smithereensblog, on 07/06/2008, -24/+110Just an FYI that there is also a lively discussion thread from the original submission of the story quoted in AppleInsider. You can join in there too if you like: http://digg.com/apple/Apple_Flips_Rogers_the_Bird_ ...

    Disclaimer: The original article appeared on my blog. Just trying to keep as much of the great discussion in one place as possible.
    • Steinr, on 07/07/2008, -2/+46dugg you up for the disclaimer. Honesty is the best policy.
    • Redge, on 07/07/2008, -7/+8Dugg you up for the same reason Steinr did. Thanks for the link by the way.
    • diothar, on 07/07/2008, -1/+8Thanks for the disclaimer and for taking the high road.
    • mpdid, on 07/07/2008, -0/+21you have pleased the internets.
    • jamez, on 07/07/2008, -15/+1"I DIT IT FIRST, I WAS THE FIRST ON THE INTERNETS GUISE!!"

      Gimmie a ***** break kid, you weren't the one to break the news
    • smithereensblog, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6Thanks for the Diggs guys. I'm glad the forthrightness was appreciated, and I'm equally stoked that this story is getting Dugg and commented on so heavily.

      Now if only Rogers would *say something*.
    • LeeSoong, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1Apple will sell these iPhones out of vending machines if they could get away with it...

      Don't kid yourself - Apple needs to push the iPhones,
      as well as Up the storage / CPU / RAM / and graphics.

    • emt1451, on 07/07/2008, -5/+2You really like to draw traffic to your blog, don't you?

      http://digg.com/users/smithereensblog/history/comm ...
      • smithereensblog, on 07/07/2008, -1/+3I'm not really sure what you're implying by posting that link... that I like to join in on the conversation when a story I broke is submitted on Digg?

        Blogging is a community endeavour and that's why I enjoy it. I'm surely not in it for the money, let me tell you.
  • OddyOh, on 07/07/2008, -5/+200Man, I hope this is true, Rogers should be whacked for their outrageous plans. Also, the Canadian government should never have let Rogers purchase Fido...dunno what on Earth they were thinking. Hmmm, one GSM provider, that sounds good... :(
    • smithereensblog, on 07/07/2008, -3/+30Well it didn't help that Fido was running themselves into the ground, dropping their prices to barely-profitable levels to gain subscribers in an effort to attract a buyer. Rogers successfully made the argument that buying them out was the only way to salvage the business, and the way things were going, they may have been right...

      Nonetheless, we need to allow some international GSM competitors into the game and quickly (hopefully the spectrum auction will take care of this.)
      • smacksaw, on 07/07/2008, -4/+8That's not true. Fido was doing just fine. It was simply a typical corporate buyout - a company that was cheap to pick up. That's all.

      • mpdid, on 07/07/2008, -0/+3I had Fido before the buyout and enjoyed it, and then once rogers picked it up it really went to *****. I'm with Virgin now and love it.
      • AROZ, on 07/07/2008, -2/+3I remember Fido had that unlimited anytime calling called "City Fido" for around fifty to sixty bucks a month. That couldn't have been very profitable.
      • stoppedcode12, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4Fido also had Country Fido where you could make unlimited anytime calling over the country with included north america LD minutes for ~70 a month.

        They were also one of the first carriers in the world to offer data over network, and have an unlimited PC card (you can use it for your notebook) data plan for $50 a month.
      • Konnnan, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1I spoke to someone who worked for Fido and apparently the City Fido plan was just a way to steal customers from Rogers so they'd be bought out at a higher price. Clever, and it worked.
      • Gutterpunk, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1Hehehe Fido wasn't running itself down to the ground. The whole Cityfido stunt was to force the hand of a buyer. The price they had set was a loss leader to entice buyers, nothing more, nothing less.

        They came out with Cityfido, which made Telus throw an offer, and when it was refused Fido came out with CountryFido to raise the bidding... Rogers bought Fido and promptly removed all those plans.

        Fido could've become a bigger player with higher prices, but it was pretty evident that they wanted to sell...

        /Was working there at the time...
        //When the news came that Rogers bought Fido, not a single employee was surprised, even if we though that Telus would be the hignest bidder
      • AROZ, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1It's also interesting that while the plans are obviously no longer available, you can supposedly buy someone's City Fido on Craigslist for around $700.
      • zigspective, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1Actually Fido has made it impossible to sign over plans, or switch users for a plan, or you know touch the plan in any way or they take it away. My partner has a City Fido plan that was once part of a family package bill when he was a teenager. Long story short, years later his dead mother is still on his bill and he can't remove her unless he wants to loose his City Fido.
    • v0yeur, on 07/07/2008, -4/+1this feels like nothing more than marketing by increasing the rarity of the iphone. it ensures that, although fewer would sell, they now sell faster.
    • LordRedSnake, on 07/07/2008, -7/+1I hope it's true too... so they're impossible to get in stores and I can keep selling the first gen iphones to Canadians at $100-200 profit a piece.
    • Mier, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4I thought it was bad in the US. Send them phones South, we'll buy em.
    • digginamish, on 07/07/2008, -1/+9It's funny to think that Apple would actually manipulate stock availability to punish someone who is overcharging for their products. This begs two questions:
      Are the Scandinavian supplies going to be slashed even more for their outrageous plans?
      Will Apple punish themselves for all of their pricing history?
    • czechsmola, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6I wrote a letter to Rogers complaining and this is what they replied.

      Dear Filip

      In your recent email, you have informed us that you are unhappy with the
      pricing for our data packages for the Iphone. You think that the prices
      for the plans are too high.

      We do apologize for any inconvenience that this has caused you and
      understand how this may make you feel.

      We do appreciate your feedback because this is very important for Rogers
      to hear comments, opinions and suggestions from our Valued Customers.
      This feedback is used to create ideas for new products, services,
      policies and procedures in the future.

      We would like to inform you that each carrier has a different pricing
      strategy. Rogers has designed a pricing structure that offers
      high-value, flexible voice and data packages so that Canadians can make
      the most of their iPhone 3G experience.

      The majority of carriers offering iPhone 3G worldwide do not have
      unlimited plans for this device. Some carriers have implemented a ?soft
      cap? so the plan isn?t truly ?unlimited?. For example, in France the
      soft cap is 500MB where we have a plan that includes 4 times that amount
      in your bucket. Unlimited plans could end up costing you more for what
      you don?t use.

      As based on reports that the average usage for the first generation
      iPhone was less than 100MB per month, our iPhone 3G plans more than
      accommodate the vast majority of customers. Rogers and Fido customers
      get 4 times the data on our $60 entry level plan (400 MB) and 20 times
      the data on our most comprehensive plan.

      Iphone 3G pricing is consistent with our recently announced data
      pricing.

      By bundling voice, text messages and data, we are able to offer the best
      value and lowest pricing compared to our other voice and data options -
      saving our customers up to 32%. All iPhone 3G plans include Visual
      Voicemail - a value of $8 per month.

      We certainly hope that this explains the rational behind our pricing
      strategies for the Iphone. Please note that Rogers has specific
      regulations and government pricing guidelines to follow and the Iphone
      coming has provided us a great opportunity to provide you with
      specialized pricing and plans for this phone.

      For any further questions or concerns that you may have we encourage you
      to make use of our online customer service at any time.

      Thank you for choosing Rogers, we appreciate your business.


      Regards,
      Kathy G.
      Rogers Online Customer Service
      http://www.rogers.com
      • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1^ yea, we all got the same one. Old.
  • jeffits420, on 07/07/2008, -8/+170Karma's a bitch. Burn in hell Rogers.
  • kkiran, on 07/07/2008, -16/+4iPhone will change the life of GSM users in Canada... no unlimited data in 3G era?? Are they kiddin or is it that Canadians don't use internet that much?
    • arobar, on 07/07/2008, -0/+3This is just Rogers trying to gouge the customer. The other major providers (Bell Canada and Telus) both introduced $15/month add-on packs for unlimited data for residential customers recently. Even the smaller providers (such as Virgin Mobile) have unlimited plans. It's not that Rogers thinks we don't use the internet much, it's that they know we use it just as much as the rest of the world. Being the exclusive carrier, they figured they'd screw us into paying high rates for low bandwidth, and then charge us again for the massive overages we can all expect.
  • farfromperfectx, on 07/07/2008, -19/+2applowned.
  • Malarie, on 07/07/2008, -17/+6Good Job, thank you Apple.
    • TokenBlack, on 07/07/2008, -6/+3Steve told me to tell you that you're welcome. You can reach him at steve@mac.com.
      • chevyorange, on 07/07/2008, -4/+3Not sure if you put that there as a joke but I've actually had action on two problems I had with Apple by emailing that address. It obviously isn't read by Steve Jobs but whoever does read that email account is in the position to make things happen.
  • tedrock, on 07/07/2008, -15/+77due to the fan boy reactions Apple knows they aren't going to sell as many phones so they aren't going waste the stock in Canada. better for it to go to Europe.
    • binarymelon, on 07/07/2008, -1/+37fan boys of what!?! money?!
      • Azerael, on 07/07/2008, -6/+16You don't *have* to buy an iPhone...
      • Spuy767, on 07/07/2008, -0/+18I'm a fanboi of cash. Every time I hear news coming out of the Federal reserve, I shoot a load in my pants. I also digg down any unfavorable articles about The Bureau of Engraving and Printing that show up on digg.
    • ambiguus, on 07/07/2008, -2/+7Im glad someone else pointed this out. It doesn't seem like they are being punished, it's more about supply and demand. With the high prices and customer dissatisfaction, they are not going to sell as much. Apple would be stupid to overstock their phones here when they'll sell better somewhere else.
    • cliffr39, on 07/07/2008, -3/+6The iPhone isn't an Apple Fan Boy thing - those people like it for the new approach to phones and many still use Windows. I, on the other hand, don't care for the iPhone but understand why some do.
    • robdazomba, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2How long will it take people to realize that the only people calling people a "fanboy" are usually fanboys themselves. The fact that you're conflating this reaction with "Apple fanboys" is pretty telling. The two have little to do with each other.

      Anyway, you pretty much gave yourself away so let us in on your big secret. What product's success keeps you awake at night?

      • tedrock, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1well i guess i am an apple fanboy. i always watch the keynotes, it's my 2nd most dugg topic. i donno i'd more consider myself a tech/gadget fanboy i really don't care who makes it. i own a ipod, a mac and a pc. no product's success keeps me up at night.
    • purelithium, on 07/07/2008, -1/+2I'll be pissed if this is true. I want an iPhone. So what if the plans aren't unlimited, it's no different than any other canadian offering. Get your own voice plan and slap on the $50 flex plan.

      No, don't go quoting Bell and Telus have unlimited on the HTC Touch, I own one and I hate it. Unlimited internet on this POS is way different than if it was on an iPhone. If I had an iPhone, I would use it 10x as much as I use the EVDO on my Touch. The browsing experience is so much better on the iphone with the multitouch zooming and excellent page rendering.
  • xsecretfiles, on 07/07/2008, -17/+5oh man, I wanted Canadians to stay away from my internets
  • RogueMountie, on 07/07/2008, -4/+151Boycott Rogers!
    • cdahlkvist, on 07/07/2008, -34/+4Boycott Canadians!

      You don't NEED an iPhone and if you want one that bad then you should shut up and fork out as much as the phone company wants you to pay for it.

      Jesus. People are such whining douchebags these days. Why can't a company charge what they want for a products/service?

      What next? Every company has to pay their employees the same salary no matter what their job because otherwise it's "just not fair"?

      There are way too many people with entitlement complexes these days.
      • ColinCampbell, on 07/07/2008, -1/+9How thick are you? This is the way markets work. Why can't a company charge whatever they want? Because if companies got to charge what they want, we'd all be paying thousands for everything. It's not about what companies want, it's what companies can charge and what customers are willing to pay for it. Don't blame the customers for wanting the phone but not wanting to pay the price. Many people (and by many I mean the vast majority) have been priced out of the iPhone's market, and people shouldn't be happy about it.
      • smacksaw, on 07/07/2008, -3/+12There's too many people making posts like yours, completely and obliviously ignorant to the fact that this isn't a free market, it isn't capitalism and it isn't choice. It's a racket. It's a gov't-sponsored monopoly, and if people don't like it, they have no recourse.
      • chevyorange, on 07/07/2008, -15/+5What the heck are you talking about? There is no monopoly, in fact Apple is probably 1% of the cell phone business. There are plenty of other phones/less capable smart phones out there if you don't like the iPhone. In fact, there are less expensive smart phones that can do much or more than the iPhone. Its not a monopoly!

        I waned a BMW for my next car but my budget only allowed me to buy a Chevy. Is BMW a monopoly? (Answer: No.)
      • jggr, on 07/07/2008, -1/+18The iPhone isn't the monopoly... Rogers is. It's the only GSM game in the country.
      • smacksaw, on 07/07/2008, -1/+6Not only is Rogers a monopoly, the Canadian gov't is the one who does not allow anyone else to compete.
      • cdahlkvist, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1ColinCampbell, smacksaw, jggr:

        No one is forcing you to buy an iPhone (or a cellular phone for that matter). Therefore, it is not a racket.

        I understand your issues with the Canadian Government not allowing competition but you 3 still reek of spoiled brats with some sort of entitlement complex.

        Let me make this clear: You are not entitled to anything in life. If you cannot afford something or are not willing to make the sacrifices to have something you really want then you just shouldn't have it.

        Make your government change it's policy if you feel that competition would lower prices but don't bitch at Apple or Rogers for charging what they feel they can get away with. These are not necessities in life. That means you don't need them. Send a message by not buying them.
    • cquilliam, on 07/07/2008, -0/+5Already done
    • SuperMoses, on 07/07/2008, -2/+2And the iPhone
      • KMartSheriff, on 07/07/2008, -2/+2The iPhone is awesome.

        The service providers like AT&T, Rogers, etc. are not.
    • ch4os1337, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1***** Rogers, I don't care if you ***** at rogers read this. I know you can watch my packets and ***** well ***** you!!!, but your my only way of getting 10mpbs...:*(
    • Skootles, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1While I'd fully support a Rogers boycott, I can't.

      We can only get Rogers internet at my place. I have a Nokia N82 from Europe, can only use that on Rogers / Fido. I'd switch to Fido but I'd have to pay hundreds of dollars in cancellation fees to Rogers. Finally, since we moved in, we've been getting Rogers cable for free.

      • pteakle, on 07/08/2008, -0/+0just a heads up, you can switch from Rogers to Fido free of charge, but you can't switch from Fido to Rogers without a hefty cancellation fee. It really doesn't matter which of the two company's you choose be with because they're essentially the same evil corporation.
  • amjadabbas, on 07/07/2008, -7/+21I HOPE SO.... THESE GREEDY BASTARDS DESERVE THAT!!
    • whyufail, on 07/07/2008, -4/+1Which greedy bastards? Rogers or Apple?
      • amjadabbas, on 07/07/2008, -0/+0well..actually it was for Rogers but i guess it could go either way...
  • Wilsomatic, on 07/07/2008, -6/+28Give them fewer shipments of a phone no one will buy from them... that'll teach em.
    • WillyWonka, on 07/07/2008, -0/+11They're just moving them to a location that will buy them. Apple will make more money.
      • Wilsomatic, on 07/07/2008, -3/+4You may need to do a U-turn, 'cause I think you just missed the point.
    • fonetix, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1IF Apple is having no problems producing iPhones then they should just sell as many of them to Rogers as they possibly can so Rogers can have them collecting dust on their shelves. Having too much money tied up in inventory with nobody buying them would put internal pressure on them to reduce their prices. But knowing Rogers they would try to reduce the price of the phone and keep the plans overpriced.
  • rebotfc, on 07/07/2008, -2/+140"Rogers is also claimed to be promptly firing the part-time staff that had been hired to handle an expected deluge of customers at some stores."

    They should fire the moron responsible for the extortionate rates.
    • BoneStamp, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2Sadly, this still hurts the people who want to buy phones... but I guess it will be worth it if it forces them to reduce the rates.
    • CedEx, on 07/07/2008, -0/+3Wouldn't that moron be ultimately Ted Rogers?

      I've heard from people who've met/worked for him that he's completely ruthless when it comes to business though. I guess that's how you make the big bucks.
    • jynweythek, on 09/17/2008, -2/+2"extortion?" seriously? if the plans are too expensive then don't buy the phone.
      • SupaDawg, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4It is extortion. It's not *JUST* the iPhone. Rogers has rates that eclipse the competition in Canada more than 2:1... and most of their data rates are upwards of 4 ***** times that which AT&T and other american carriers charge.
      • Jeffler, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2Extortion is canada wide jwiesenborn...even our cheapest rates don't compete with an average US rate. To make matters worse, Rogers takes full advantage of being the only GSM in town.
  • mal1964, on 07/07/2008, -7/+61Apple doesn't give a *****, I'm sure its a supply and demand issue. Its all about sales and if you think its not you're living in dream land.
    • Papajohn56, on 07/07/2008, -0/+19yeah. high plan prices will reduce sales of iphones, so apple doesn't want units just sitting on the shelves. it makes sense for them to do it due to the exorbitant plan prices
      • mal1964, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1You're right but an inferior provider was more of a issue with me, I didn't buy because of AT&T. That was a huge deal with many people in the USA and many were not happy, But sales still shined. If the service is good people will pay i believe over poor service somewhere else. I don't know anything about Rogers price, Is it way out of line or is the comparison with AT&T's price that makes it look bad?
      • Teej, on 07/07/2008, -0/+5@mal: $93 a month (tax in) on a three year contract is the cheapest data plan (400MB) you can get WITH caller ID/voicemail.

        Is that way out of line? I think so.
      • mal1964, on 07/07/2008, -0/+3@teej I agree, That's *****. 3 ***** years what a joke! Sounds worst than getting married
      • Bootes, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2And who says ATT is inferior? Who are they inferior to? Lots of people would have been unhappy no matter what provider Apple went with. All the cell companies sort of suck, at least ATT has a large network. Our only other GSM provider is T-Mobile that doesn't have the coverage area and had no 3G before and now barely has one.
    • Coffeedemon, on 07/07/2008, -3/+16No man. Its Apple showing how much they love us all. They are the bestest company in the whole wide world.
      • GeorgeStone2, on 07/07/2008, -1/+2I lol'd
      • Papajohn56, on 07/07/2008, -11/+2you sound like a typical digger with Google's balls in their mouth
      • jazzbeaux, on 07/07/2008, -3/+3And you would know, eh PJ?
      • Coffeedemon, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1I could care less about Google. In fact I'm not overly keen on how they've managed to make everyone believe that fulltext search in a corporate environment is something we'd actually benefit from as opposed to parametric search and structured results using all of that dreadful metadata. I'm responding to people who actually believe that Apple is doing any of this for your benefit. If anything they want to distance themselves from any bad press in order to sell you their phone.
    • punkcat, on 07/07/2008, -0/+7the story is a bit odd but i'd like to believe they are being punished.
    • RetlawST, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4Apple gives a ***** because they have a brand image to maintain. They've never had particularly cheap products, but they usually have fantastic service. Rogers is not a great choice for them.
      • mal1964, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6"Rogers is not a great choice for them"
        What did they have to choose from?
      • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+2"Rogers is not a great choice for them"
        What did they have to choose from?


        >>The sad truth. One day....
    • pedepy, on 07/07/2008, -8/+2of course it is: but it's still a blow to Rogers, and that's all that matters in the end ! :))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
  • Jenadae, on 07/07/2008, -1/+170I wouldn't call this punishment... i'd call it shipping what they expect to sell with the ***** plans offered...
    • anubis2night, on 07/07/2008, -3/+1My thoughts exactly, but given the rampant fanboyism here people will bend over lube up and thank apple for their support.
  • SpecialStyrke, on 07/07/2008, -0/+17Norway also has a big problem with their data plans too. We got like Canada just 1 gigabyte of data. Why hasen't Apple made their carriers give unlimited data for a extra fee? It's rather stupid.
    • MacParrot, on 07/07/2008, -2/+1Because Apple (like Motorola/SamSung/RIM) doesn't care what the plans are for each phone. Other than reducing the number of phones to a market, they have no power over what the data plans will be. Now that they are no longer receiving data plan residuals, they just want to sell phones. Why send more phones where the market will be less inspired to purchase one because of crappy service plans?
  • kenvsryu, on 07/07/2008, -2/+10rofl sanctioned good one guys. apple is sending it to a market with more demand just to please canadians and not to make money.
  • WoollyMittens, on 07/07/2008, -1/+44Monopolies can not be tolerated in capitalism. The system is not designed to work that way. Rogers in Canada and Telstra in Australia are good examples of this.
    • whiteyMcBrown, on 07/07/2008, -1/+11What makes it worse is that the government won't let other providers from outside of Canada come in and give them competition. AT&T or Sprint can't come here. HBO and Nickelodeon can't come here. The government won't let anyone outside of the government take care of local post, transportation, even liquor... That's right... in Ontario (and I think most of the rest of Canada) the government is our liquor supplier. Prices are about 30% higher than in Quebec, a province where mere shop owners can give each other competition and come to a price. I certainly wouldn't move over something as simple as a phone, but this reminder of how ***** this socialist business is might get me to.
      • mousky, on 07/07/2008, -4/+5Quebec is the place where margarine cannot be the same colour as butter. Quebec is the place where French has to have more prominence in shop signs. Quebec is the place that receives equalization money from the Federal government and then uses that money to reduce it's taxes and offer subsidized day care.
      • Kyan, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1Good for Quebec.
      • kinseyincanada, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2The government doesnt own the Beer Stores in Ontario
      • AROZ, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1What are you talking about when it comes to transportation? Freight is fully private, but admittedly public transit exists. Public transit is in most cases not profitable because it gives everyone access, not just the most popular and dense areas.
      • duckstreet, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2The government most definitely DOES own the beer stores in ontario.
      • ENFOUR, on 07/07/2008, -0/+0Wikipedia says:
        "Forty-nine percent of the company is owned by the Labatt arm of InBev of Belgium; forty-nine percent is owned by Molson Coors Brewing Company which has headquarters in both the United States and Canada; and the remaining two percent is owned by Japanese-owned Sleeman Breweries. [1]

        Although founded by the Government of Ontario, it is only linked by a relationship with Alcohol and Gaming Commission of Ontario (AGCO). As of November 2006, the company operates 450 retail stores, [2] operating as "The Beer Store", which sell beer to the general public. BRI also has the government legislated exclusive right to sell domestic beer to Ontario bars and restaurants, of which more than 17,000 are licensed to sell alcohol. The LCBO sells imported beer to bars and restaurants. Imported beer is available for sale at The Beer Store, but this product is actually imported by the LCBO and then sold to Brewers Retail."

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brewers_Retail_Inc.
      • AROZ, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1The Beer Store was originally a brewers co-op, now it's run by three multinationals. So, beer is sold privately. The government controlled LCBO sells the imported beverages (from beyond the United States), but the Beer Store sells the most beer, particularly because all restaurants and bars buy from them.
    • opticrime, on 07/07/2008, -1/+2"Monopolies can not be tolerated in capitalism."

      I don't know about that. But what I can say is that oligopolies are often tolerated in capitalism, and that oligopolies tacitly collude to the very limit of the law to keep prices high. This is particularly true in industries with high financial and regulatory barriers to entry.
    • DreKor, on 07/07/2008, -1/+4Nope. Monopolies are the logical end result of capitalism. You're thinking of a free market economy. That aside, Rogers is being a dick.
    • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1You should start a cell phone company and save us
  • 9bpm9, on 07/07/2008, -16/+6So by shipping less to Rogers, they are basically only punishing the people in Canada who want iPhones by making them less available? Smart.
  • doctordbx, on 07/07/2008, -5/+19Please explain to me how this isn't just "revising projections" as opposed to "punishment"?

    If Apple really wanted to punish Rogers, there's be a get out of the deal agreement in the contract I am sure they could execute. The truth is, Steve doesn't care about Canadians.
    • RSterkenburg, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1I don't believe it. Obviously Apple cares that they're not going to sell as many phones!
      PHONES = PROFIT. LESS SOLD PHONES = LESS FREE MONEY
    • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1He cares about me *****.
  • MarrowMan, on 07/07/2008, -3/+16What did Rogers think would happen? That we'd all just bend over and take it up the ass, while giving fellatio? I don't ***** think so.
  • icndvl, on 07/07/2008, -11/+41When companies the size of Rogers and Apple make an agreement, they have this thing called a contract. A contract will dictate the terms of the agreement. If Apple cared about unlimited bandwidth so much they would have included a provision in the contract; they did not (or so would be fair to assume as this would otherwise be legal battle) so they do not care -- any indication otherwise is just a PR move. In fact I would be willing to guess that this whole rumor is a guerrilla PR move from Apple.

    Also no one is forcing anyone to buy an iphone, which by any standard is a luxury item. If you wait a while chances are prices will drop due to market forces alone. Its natural for a LIMITED supply product to start at a higher price and then drop over time. Life can continue without an Iphone.
    • freediverx, on 07/07/2008, -0/+9" If you wait a while chances are prices will drop due to market forces alone. Its natural for a LIMITED supply product to start at a higher price and then drop over time. Life can continue without an Iphone."

      The price of the iPhone is not the problem. Nobody is complaining about paying $199. The problem is Rogers' ridiculously expensive rate plans, which start as overpriced but are sure to get even more expensive after customers go over their allowed data limits. As Rogers has a virtual monopoly, there are no market forces at play to bring the rates down.
      • icndvl, on 07/07/2008, -8/+0Rogers does not have a monopoly over the cellular phone market; they are in competition with other companies such as Bell and Telus. They do have a PRODUCT that is ahead of the competition. As time goes by, competition will introduce their smart phones as well and the prices on the phones and the plans will go down naturally. This is the way the market works. As Canadians, we have a right to vote, a right to healthcare, a right to a lot of things...but a right to an Iphone is preposterous.
      • SealandRes1, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1Rogers is in competition with bell and telus?

        That's like saying diesel cars are in competition with gasoline cars.

        The cellular network situation in cananda is similar to having 2 manufacturers making diesel cars and only 1 manufacturer making gasoline cars.

        For a population of 30 million+ people in Canada

        That's simply not enough competition.
      • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1Obviously icndvl, you have no comprehension of CDMA vs. GSM. Go wiki it. Thanks.
    • BoneStamp, on 07/07/2008, -4/+1The Rogers data rates have dropped in half for the iPhone, how come nobody was complaining like this before the iPhone came along? Do you know that alochol is less than half the price in the United States too? I wonder if apple started making booze if this same thing would happen?
    • icndvl, on 07/07/2008, -5/+1If it weren't an Apple product no one would care. Its only a phone with fancy bells and whistles...
    • Bootes, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1Remember that the US doesn't really have unlimited data either. All our cell companies limit "Unlimited" data to 5GB a month. Which of course is better than Rogers, but it isn't unlimited.
  • ButlerMonkey, on 07/07/2008, -0/+13I'd be surprised if Apple didn't have a reaction to the negative press, but if this is true, I can just see Rogers claiming that the Canadian sales of the 3G iPhone on their network is a great success because they sold out faster then expected.

    Also, why aren't people bothered by the fact that Apple will only sell this locked with a provider? I still think that was a bad move on Apple part, or at least for consumers. I guess Apple forgot that entire concept "Think Different" campaign they had going a few years back.
    • freediverx, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4Rogers is the only cell phone carrier in Canada that uses GSM. AT&T is one of two carriers in the US who use GSM, and the other one (T-Mobile) sucks even worse than AT&T. The only real way to bring any competition to iPhone rate plans would be to release a CDMA version of the phone so companies like Verizon could step in. Not that Verizon is known for cheap plans, but at least they're known for great service and that would be the competitive factor.
      • chevyorange, on 07/07/2008, -0/+3Not sure if T-Mobile sucks worse than AT&T. From a morals standpoint, AT&T went right along with the wiretapping of American citizens without batting an eye. As far as I know, T-Mobile didn't. That type of thing is important to me and other than the high cost of plans is something that makes me wary of buying an iPhone.
      • Bootes, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1I would say T-Mobile has better support and morals. Their network is inferior to ATTs, and that's really the most important factor in a cell service. No matter how great T-Mobile is, if I can't use my phone because there's no service, then I'm not going to pay them.
    • digiguy, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2007-01-28-veriz ...
  • seanieb, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5What about O2 Ireland? their iphone plan is a joke also.
  • sirflibble, on 07/07/2008, -4/+11LOL all you people are whinging.. you should see what us Australians have to put up with.

    I'm getting a $49 cap on Optus with a Whopping $300 voice call credit and a massive 250MB a month.

    The TOP plan is 1GB a month.

    http://www.optusiphone.com.au/getdoc/3727f208-955d ...
    • ZimbuTheMonkey, on 07/07/2008, -0/+7Yeah, that is pretty terrible for you guys. But it doesn't mean we'll quietly put up with slightly less ***** rates just because some other country in the world has it worse.
    • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1So wheres your petition? We have one.
  • dashrevery, on 07/07/2008, -2/+2They aren't exactly punishing the company by shorting their shipment but rather the people who really do want the iPhone regardless the cost. This means that those who decided to "wait it out" will not be getting one at all. I would also like to open up a can of warms and point out that people are arguing about the Rogers/Fido rates rather blindly. I guess nobody noticed the sub-section that gives you "Unlimited" access at their wireless hotspots which are spread all over major cities [this plan would previously cost you around $40/month] from coffee shops to random locations around the city of Toronto [not to mention other companies offering free Wifi at their locations] -- I'm tired of reading these stores. You don't even need the 2GB plan to support your internet addiction; most of the time you are at home or going out you have the wireless access.
    • freediverx, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4It's true that the free wifi brings some value to their rate plans (assuming Rogers/Fido truly offers good hotspot coverage country-wide.) But that limits your usage to fixed locations, taking a lot of mobility out of this mobile phone. Do you expect customers to turn off push email and GPS functions every time they wander away from a free wifi hotspot? Kind of takes away any benefit from having email and mapping functions, don'tcha think?
  • davidrsmith, on 07/07/2008, -10/+3WE ARE HEARD!
  • Morghin, on 07/07/2008, -3/+12Bad press + retarded plan = fewer sales -> (same cash made ->?) less phones needed -> Divert to Europe -> ??? -> Profit!
  • smacksaw, on 07/07/2008, -10/+5I'm sure this comment will rankle the emotions of people who love Apple, but this was a dick move on Apple's part. Apple has a say in these plans. They sold Rogers out before Rogers could sell them out. Apple keeps the great rep and Rogers gets the bad rap. And every one of you who buries me for that comment proves the point about Apple's good will towards you.

    I'm not defending Rogers. Just remember - it takes two to tango.
    • MacParrot, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6Apple made an exclusive deal with Rodgers to sell the iPhone in Canada. Just as Motorola, SamSung, RIM, etc make exclusive deals on cell phones expected to be big sellers. Apple has little to no say on what the plans for data will be after the fact. The worst Apple can do is express displeasure by reducing shipments.

      This doesn't make Apple any better than Rodgers (or any other tech company you care to name), but Apple in this case sells phones, Rodgers sells access. That's as far as it goes.
      • smacksaw, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1Apple had all the say in the world with AT&T. I'd hardly call that little or no say!
      • Woolmonkey, on 07/07/2008, -0/+3Apple also had other carriers to choose from so AT&T had to get Apple on their side or Apple could just go somewhere else. Now in Canada unless Apple started making a CDMA phone Rogers is the only carrier so if Apple wants the phone in Canada they need Rogers.
      • directive0, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2It's "Rogers", MacParrot.
  • vmeeno, on 07/07/2008, -6/+1You wish...
    • RSterkenburg, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1That may have been THE most worthless comment I have EVER seen on Digg. It's at least gotta be up in the top... 1.
  • whiteyMcBrown, on 07/07/2008, -1/+6Is this really a sanction though? Or are Apple diverting stock to where there might be more demand? Rogers is still the only iPhone supplier in Canada so if you want one you'd have to go through them. I just think they're worried that a bunch might end up sitting there, not selling.
  • jordansampson, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6Does anyone else think giving them LESS units will somehow make DEMAND higher? We know there are people out there who are going to buy the phone no matter what the cost, so this just enables them to somehow justify the price. "Look almost every store sold out with those plans so why change them"
  • phoomp, on 07/07/2008, -3/+1"punishment"?

    This will just generate more demand, certainly working to the *benefit* of Apple, and maybe even Rogers.
    • mhender, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2No it wont. People know if they're gonna buy this phone or not. The demand is there whether theres a shortage or not. They just realize that they aren't going to sell the millions as speculated.
    • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1Well, apparently 42,000 people on the petition think otherwise.
  • Zoidberg, on 07/07/2008, -2/+8Less supply = Rogers' spin will claim that there an overwhelming demand for the iPhone, and those petitions were crazy.

    It's simple - they are artificially creating a shortage for free PR. Remember the Wii?
  • Ramzy, on 07/07/2008, -1/+6I only wish the pricing was the same as Rogers, here in Australia.

    Over here, Optus are charging $179 per month for a 1GB cap. Yes, one hundred and seventy nine dollars per freaking month. The iPhone is also $897 to purchase standalone.
    • elliam, on 07/07/2008, -2/+2And your dollar is worth how much?

      "OMG, the iPhone is 3,000 pesos!!!"
    • Renster84, on 07/07/2008, -0/+0897.00 AUD = 857.624 USD

      Australia Dollars
      1 AUD = 0.956103 USD
      United States Dollars
      1 USD = 1.04591 AUD

      179.00 AUD = 171.144 USD
    • Envenom, on 07/08/2008, -0/+1Kangaroos don't use cellphones.
  • mal1964, on 07/07/2008, -2/+1@pj, No a typical digger/apple fan boy's reply would have a lot more detail and at least two paragraphs long. He's just having some good clean fun. Now here's a quote that i got as a reply once, I think this is closer to what you mean.
    "At least google has a heart" He was totally serious
    • RSterkenburg, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1Actually, we have "reply" features here. None of this "@" crap is necessay.
      • mal1964, on 07/07/2008, -0/+1@rsterkenburg
        Who are you talking to?
  • nycmac247, on 07/07/2008, -2/+3Is this part of the new Punisher movie?
  • seekup78, on 07/07/2008, -6/+2At last!! At least it shows that Apple supports customers a little bit.
  • ZenFu, on 07/07/2008, -2/+8It's doubtful this is true.

    After all, if apple WERE doing this, they'd be shipping iPhones with canadian plugs, rogers info on the back of the box and french instructions to the european market (where canadian plugs won't work...and yes, i know france is in europe but they don't count because none of the other EU countries speak french natively). That'd mean more money spent producing (or adding) EU plugs to the boxes and re-stickering them with EU telco info.

    This is probably a fanboy rumor (or perhaps clever marketing by rogers) to make the iPhone crowd think rogers got bent over by Apple as punishment for doing the same thing to their consumers. Ergo, come launch day people won't feel so bad about purchasing from rogers cos they'll be thinking that they're sticking it to the man (or something to that effect).

    Either way, i call BS.

    Oh, and americans/canadians? My heart goes out to you. You guys are truly getting screwed over by the telcos out there. Thankfully, us brits got a pretty decent deal on contracts (i know right? I'm as amazed as y'all are) for the iPhone. Almost covered my screen in coffee when i saw you had to pay for incoming SMSs or take a text plan just to recieve. Now that's really *****.
    • octus, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2So they'll package fewer for Canada. I don't think anyone is suggesting they'll take existing Canadian stock and repackage it, they'll just cut down on current production. Apple doesn't just ship one gigantic lot of iPhones, it is a continuous flow from the factories, with Apple controlling the tap.
    • Incidents, on 07/07/2008, -2/+1@ZenFu:
      We don't pay for incoming SMSs. What are you talking about? There is no cost or text plan required to receive texts.
    • Renster84, on 07/07/2008, -1/+1I remember reading about you Americans having to pay to recieve texts too.

      I dont think it has ever been that way in the UK.
      Also for some unknown reason the 2nd most money grabbing company in the UK (Just behind Orange) are offering unlimited free data.
      Plus access to over 9,500 wifi hotspots free.

      Text plan could of been a bit better, but you know, they had to think of something.
  • mochouinard, on 07/07/2008, -9/+3Damn I hate Apple worshiper... The main reason there is less shipment to Canada is because the demand is less than expected (because of the backslash on Rogers/Fido), so having store out of stock is actually better for Apple show off of their device than having a bunch of device not sold... Also, the shipment were not sent to the US, they were sent in Europe, why do you think ? Because it a lot more profitable to sell over there than here (Same thing Nintendo is doing with their shipment).

    So Apple is evil like the rest of the corporations. They might have wanted to be good once(Like Microsoft, IBM, Google), but people who control those business ultimately are share holders and all they sadly only look for more profit. The only way to get the control back is with real patent & license free open source, open device and open standard, because they protect our investment and promote innovation and help to concentrate everyone to work on a single version. I will never buy an iPhone, unless I can actually install whatever I want (dualboot apple OS or other OS). I want to buy a personal communication device, not Apple Religion Icon / portable Bible.

    Anyway, I try to do what I can on my end. I've finally switched completely* to an Open source OS on my desktop and laptop. As for my cell phone, it suppose to use an open os, but is locked and infected with a bunch of Rogers apps and Trial version of TETRIS !!! For the moment, I ordered the OpenMoko Neo, I know it ugly, but I ratter support something that has an good ideology behind it.

  • Paramnesia, on 07/07/2008, -6/+1Thank you Apple
  • alanr19, on 07/07/2008, -1/+6"Apple has diverted a significant amount of its initial iPhone 3G Canadian deliveries to Europe"

    I think this has more to do with the fact that there is a backlash against rogers and projected sales figures will be down because of it. But apple fanboys are spinning this story so it looks like apple sticking up for the consumer. When the hell have they ever done that? they dont give a ***** about canucks, or anyone else for that matter.

    It's all about the bottom line $$$.
    • clockdist, on 07/07/2008, -0/+2Even if they did give a damn about the customer, it would be for $$ reasons anyway.
      No customers = no money.
  • sopranogrl22, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4If by "sanctioned" you mean "punished," then yes...

    http://wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=sanction ...
  • RobotLeAwesome, on 07/07/2008, -0/+5It's not that big of a deal, it's pretty clear they won't sell as many phones because of the pricing.
  • pleaseno, on 07/07/2008, -7/+1Apple can suck my plums.
  • pond70, on 07/07/2008, -9/+2HAHHAHAHA .... so when is Apple sending in the Peace Troops to enforce the "sanctions" ....wow what a joke
  • monkeyrun, on 07/07/2008, -0/+7It's just Econ 101 supply and demand.

    With price like that, it doesn't take a genius to predict the demand.
  • llsethj, on 07/07/2008, -1/+2In a word, no
    http://blogs.computerworld.com/rogers_receiving_re ...
  • cquilliam, on 07/07/2008, -1/+26***** ROGERS
  • LogicBomB, on 07/07/2008, -0/+23Canada needs more cell phone competition.
  • filo4000, on 07/07/2008, -2/+0It's really a piss off because I was planning on getting one before all of this came out, I'm sure rogers has projected for themselves how to make the most money possible but this is one less sale right here
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