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2009 Jetta BlueTDI Comes to US This Summer, Sports 60 MPG

gas2.org — VW’s ultra-low emission Jetta BlueTDI will be coming to the US mid-summer, according to an announcement made late last month at the Vienna Motor Symposium. This newer version of the Jetta will meet the strictest emissions standards in the world —BIN5/LEV2—which are enforced by 5 US states: California, Massachusetts, Maine, New York, and Vermont.

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  • maddvibe, on 05/10/2008, -3/+78Want!
    • Chompy, on 05/10/2008, -26/+9..to spend all your time in the shop! Volkswagens are trash, and have been ever since they started building most of them (for North America) in Mexico.
      • Azio, on 05/10/2008, -4/+9Not true, my parents have had 2 jettas, a 1996 and a 2004, over 2.5 million km on them combined, with no major problems at all. I think we had to replace one of the power windows on the old one once.

        Furthermore, diesels are significantly more reliable than gasoline cars
        • Chompy, on 05/10/2008, -9/+4Oh *****, you brought anecdotal evidence to the table. I guess that means all of them are OK.

          Consumer Reports rates them as the third most UNRELIABLE brand sold in the United States. They used to be awesome, but after 2001 they started churning out *****.
        • alamandrax, on 05/10/2008, -2/+3I have a '99 Jetta. Rides like a dream. Gives me approx 24-26MPG though. Would love to see that higher. The only problems I've had with it so far was having to replace a lightbulb and grease from under the hood.
      • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -2/+4And yet you offer so much more than just "anecdotal" evidence here.
    • AngelBunny, on 05/10/2008, -9/+3it depends. my guess is this 60 MPG highway is 60 mpg at 55 mph and in some spots of the country average speed of traffic exceeds 85mph. Unless I find a car that gets better mpg at 80+mph then I could care less what its MPG rating is. When one drives above a certain speed some of the lower MPG rated cares get better MPG than the higher rated MPG vehicles.
      • jgallagher721, on 05/10/2008, -0/+7Citation needed.
        • balthisar, on 05/10/2008, -3/+1EPA, dude. It's how they rate mpg, ya know? Federal regulations and all? Granted, all of the new tests "better reflect today's driving habits" and we have decreased EPA ratings, but EPA ratings don't reflect 80 mph. I can identify with the grandparent, because that's the average commuter speed. (On the other hand, gas is still affordable, and I won't worry until it hits five bucks.)
          • Thefascist, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1That's what I've been telling myself, and I ride a motorcycle.
      • bigred, on 05/10/2008, -2/+5Thats not quite how it works... I don't know of a single car that will get better mileage at higher speeds, when the wind resistance is higher, rolling resistance is higher, and your engine needs to spin at higher speeds. Once you're over 45-50MPH your mileage decreases significantly.

        For example, the older 1999-2006 TDI's were rated at 45MPG highway, but many people can get them over 50+ MPG by simply doing 55MPH instead of 65MPH on the highway. Personally, I tried it on one tank, got about 750mi on 15 of diesel fuel, but I almost died from boredom, so I haven't done it since. My current mileage is about 42MPG doing about 75MPH.

        Anyways, I'd love a car that could get me max fuel efficiency at 75MPH, but physics is physics - travelling faster will always use more fuel than slower.... there would be a major engine flaw if that was not the case.
        • wrxpert, on 05/10/2008, -2/+2I would be probably have to shoot you if you were going 55 on the freeways in So-Cal.
        • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -0/+4And I got 55+ mpg from a tank in a ' 99 TDI at highway speeds. My regular milage was 45+ w/ stop and go and highway speeds above 70mph, yes, I kept a spreadsheet. Compared it to my 2.0 Golf as well. So?
          • troye, on 05/11/2008, -0/+1is that diesel or no, i'm just curious

            *dugg for using a spreadsheet*
    • wwnexc, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Drove an 08 Jetta TDI. 40 mpg city and still fun to drive.
    • renegadeafk, on 05/10/2008, -2/+4Why the hell do you need to go 80+ mph?
      • Mark03, on 05/10/2008, -2/+1On some rural highways the speed limit is 85.
    • petern43, on 05/11/2008, -0/+1It'll only cost $18,000 too!

      http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleI ...
  • theaterman, on 05/10/2008, -17/+51Too bad Diesel fuel is going to be over $5.00 a gallon by mid summer.
    • Modestexcuse, on 05/10/2008, -6/+3It's $4.50 here in Oregon, and expected to reach that $5 mark you mention. OUCH.
    • winmywii, on 05/10/2008, -2/+44True, but if you can get 60mpg it will still be cheaper than most cars.
      • brundlefly76, on 05/10/2008, -2/+3Just like the Prius we'll need to see what real life vs EPA reported is.

        Where I live, the cheapest Diesel is a full $1 more per gallon than *PREMIUM* gasoline! OUCH!
        • ninfudo, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1I think 60 MPG might be a little optimistic. In the article, Jens Hadler mentioned that this engine is 12% more fuel efficient that its predecessor, the 2007 TDI, which got an EPA estimate of 30/38. A 12% improvement would mean that the 2009 TDI will get 34/43, which is still pretty freakin good.
          • wherley, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2There was no 2007 Jetta TDI in the US. The 2006 Jetta TDI was rated 36/41. He might be talking about a non-US predecessor.
    • LordSnave, on 05/10/2008, -7/+5I just filled up my '04 diesel Excursion tonight. $173.50 :(
      • scotticus, on 05/10/2008, -5/+18You didn't realize that gas prices were going to continue to rise when you bought that monstrosity?
        • inigomntoya, on 05/10/2008, -4/+7Diesel fuel prices were supposed to stay low - which is why so many people invested in diesel engines. But now, it has to be imported because there aren't enough refineries to keep up with demand. Everyone counts on inflation, but no one considers being raped.
          • scotticus, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2Fuel prices aren't indexed to inflation, you goof. It's supply and demand. We have a steady, soon to be decreasing supply and increasing demand.

            Switching to diesel because it was cheaper at the time is extremely shortsighted. A better move would have been purchasing a fuel efficient vehicle.
      • jchrome, on 05/10/2008, -1/+6That's what we call 'bad karma'.
        *ba-dum-dum*
      • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -1/+4Hope that Excursion is worth going back and forth to work and getting groceries.
    • peestandingup, on 05/10/2008, -0/+6http://www.greasecar.com/
      • bigred, on 05/10/2008, -6/+1Disclaimer: Installing this kit in a direct injection diesel (such as the TDI) will severely shorten the lifespan of your engine.
        • peestandingup, on 05/10/2008, -0/+6And where did you get this info??
        • shodanx, on 05/10/2008, -0/+4out of his ass
          if you get your chemistery wrong you'll end up with polymerised oil in your injector, a 200$ fix big deal, the engine's not dead.....
        • bigred, on 05/10/2008, -0/+5Deny it all you want, but cooking oil is not the same viscosity as diesel fuel at 90 degrees, even when you heat it to 200 degrees. So your injection pump has to work harder to push the thicker fuel through your injectors, it doesn't atomize properly when spraying out of the injectors, and tiny droplets will stick to your pistons, and cylinder walls, and then burn slowly on them. This will cause your piston rings to wear out, you'll score your cylinder walls, and in extreme cases you'll melt a hole through your piston.

          And that's not to mention all the unburned fuel that will build up on your exhaust valves, restricting airflow. It's not a good idea to run these things in a direct injection engine, thats not just me saying that, do some research. These kits work quite well in an IDI engine (indirect injection), where you have a pre-combustion chamber where the fuel starts burning before going into the cylinder. The old Mercedes Turbo Diesel engines were IDI, as well as the Volkswagen diesels up to 1999.

          So I'm just trying to warn anyone that sees your comment on digg, and has a DI engine, who figures "OMG Free fuel" and then ends up with a $3000-4000 repair bill, because they didn't do their research.
    • dlsspy, on 05/10/2008, -1/+18Gasoline will, too, but you won't be getting 60MPG.
      • brundlefly76, on 05/10/2008, -1/+3Yeah but diesel is going to get there a hell of a lot sooner - if we are short on refineries now, wait until a really popular diesel passenger car comes out - like this one. I feel bad for truckers, they are really taking it on the chin.
        • themonkman, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2I feel sorry for the truckers, too. I saw on the news a story about one small trucking company here in San Diego going down to Tijuana to fill up their tanks on diesel because it's half the price as it is just inside the US border.
    • themonkman, on 05/10/2008, -0/+21Don't forget that the diesel engine will outlast the body of the car itself. Diesel engines are almost always made from a solid iron block (like my 98 Jetta TDI). Compared to aluminum blocks, they last much longer. I expect to get 300,000+ off of mine. So far it has 187,000 miles with zero engine problems. It still runs like it's brand new, even though it's 10 years old.
      • dhughes, on 05/10/2008, -1/+8 Not just the block but everything in the engine stronger and heavy duty. Also there are no spark plugs, plug wires or distributor. Diesels are durable, but not indestructible.
        • themonkman, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2Everything is destructible, especially if you don't take care of it.
      • swiftheart, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Almost all cars today are driven under their own power to junkyards. The engine isn't the issue, the problem is all the other ***** failing on the car. (Particularly on newer cars which have far more "critical" parts.)
        • mos6507, on 05/10/2008, -1/+4The main issue is a disposable culture.
        • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Yeah, and those engines get pulled and reused. The reason it's in the Junkyard is becuase the body is too ***** up the only good thing IS the engine.
      • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1If that engine can get 600k miles on it, it wont outlast the body of my 72 datsun 510
    • pell, on 05/10/2008, -0/+6Also you will use half the gas most cars use. So although it is pricey, it will cost less overall for gas.
    • Uaedaien, on 05/10/2008, -4/+5Oh noes! Welcome to European gas prices. $8 a gallon here in the UK.
      • Osirus1156, on 05/10/2008, -6/+1Thats 4 euros ;)
      • Dachublez, on 05/10/2008, -8/+0Build more refineries or get the ***** over it. You ***** European ***** heads act like you pay more for crude oil than we do. You don't we just have more refineries and lower taxes on said fuel.
        • Blandyman, on 05/10/2008, -2/+6Wow Amerifag. Chill the ***** out.
      • SeymourC, on 05/10/2008, -3/+0Oh noes! It'll be $10 a gallon in Europe.

        And we'll both be paying the same price for crude. Hooray taxes.
    • MixMastaKooz, on 05/10/2008, -0/+13Yea, at $5 a gallon and getting 60 mpg then it would cost $.083 per mile. At 3.50 a gallon for regular and getting 33 mpg, the cost per mile is $.106. Even with diesel at $5 a gallon, you're still saving around 2 cents a mile.
    • TexMexMatt, on 05/10/2008, -1/+6At Alamo Biodiesel in San Antonio its 3.25 a gallon. You would save even more using that stuff. Renewable and your money stays in the USA.
    • huge129, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3why the f*ck is diesel more expensive than normal gas in the US? Its a less refined sub product of petrol!!! For as long as i remember diesel has been a lot cheaper in my country.
      • dhughes, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1 It's used for so many things, home heating oil is the same thing as diesel so if it's very cold outside the demand goes up quickly in a short period of time. The same for trucks and trains, large volumes of it needed quickly all of a sudden, maybe due to more people traveling at the same time or a popular product that is being shipped, would put strain on the production system.
    • ninfudo, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1I hear we can't produce enough bio-fuel without the price of foods sky rocketing, and we can't produce enough of it to support our automotive infrastructure.
      • Chandon, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Like anything, there isn't a fixed supply of crops that can be turned into biodiesel - instead, there is a supply curve. As the price goes up, more such crops will be produced because more expensive production choices become economically viable.

        That will raise the price of food slightly, but not as much as the petrofuel apologists imply - because biodiesel and food don't compete for the exact same set of crop resources. As the price of fuel rises, currently unused farmland will be brought into production and new biofuel-specific crops will be used (like switchgrass) - as that starts to happen, others will see that it's economically viable and the prices will come back down a bit. In the medium-term, we'll also start to see commercially viable algae biodiesel.

        If the market acts as it should (i.e. the government doesn't screw things up too much), diesel prices will end up being below E85 gasoline prices and significantly below E10 gasoline prices because biodiesel is easier to produce than ethanol. Once that happens, people will buy Diesels and things will calmly move to a biodiesel economy.
  • davidryal, on 05/10/2008, -47/+82now, if only males were allowed to drive Jettas...
    • onesidedsquare, on 05/10/2008, -2/+7my wife got me to buy one, i learned afterwards what it means :-(
    • protodon, on 05/10/2008, -1/+13oh they're not oops. amazing what you will do when you no one's telling you that you can't.
    • themonkman, on 05/10/2008, -7/+49WTF? Jetta's aren't like the Beetle. They look as neutral as any other coupe or sedan. Plus on my TDI I get 45mpg. Keep driving your F250's. I'll be saving buttloads of cash and taking out your girl with the bankroll :)
      • inigomntoya, on 05/10/2008, -16/+3Uhhh - two problems with the above statement - Jettas are NOT like the Beetle (at least in looks). And Beetles are NOT neutral. No car with a flower vase built into the dash is neutral. In building the Beetle, they made a very bold statement about who they were geared toward.
        • MisterWhite, on 05/10/2008, -1/+9People who aren't homophobic?
        • praisethelard, on 06/06/2008, -2/+5Uhhh - that's what he said.
        • pookkake, on 05/10/2008, -1/+9He was talking about the Jetta being neutral, you idiot.
          • themonkman, on 05/10/2008, -2/+3Imbeciles generally have comprehension difficulties. He probably thought that the Federal Stimulus program meant someone from the IRS was going to come to his house to give him a handjob.
        • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -3/+1You would spend a whole bankroll in one night with a girl? You really do suit driving a Jetta.
          Whipped.
      • sfmman, on 05/10/2008, -3/+2The last good looking Jetta was the Mk3.
      • legoalert33, on 05/10/2008, -19/+4I got a Chevy not a Ford. Your statement is now invalid. Have fun in your ***** car.
        • sapo916, on 05/10/2008, -1/+4The Statement wasn't even directed towards you.
        • themonkman, on 05/13/2008, -0/+1It's not invalid because your the one getting less than 20mpg and I'm getting over 40mpg. I will be having fun in my ***** car...with your mother tied up like a Thanksgiving turkey in the back seat. She squeals like a pig when I whip out the turkey baster.

          Enjoy your Chevy when it breaks down under the 100,000 mile mark. I won't be picking up your ass on the side of the road, thats for sure.

    • insllvn, on 05/10/2008, -4/+32I am so glad that my masculinity and self image aren't tied to what kind of car I drive. That would make me such a huge douche bag...

      PS. I love my Jetta.
      • IllBeBack, on 05/10/2008, -9/+7You are in a state of homodenial.
        Cancel or Allow?
        • insllvn, on 05/10/2008, -2/+4God help me, but I laughed my ass off at that. Dugg.
    • reddikilowatt, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2The TDI logo helps to man it up a bit.

      How many dumb blonds with tiny dogs in their bags would know how to get diesel fuel?
    • elShaggy, on 05/10/2008, -3/+7Don't let american car enthusiasts make jokes of your sexuality because you drive a Jetta. These are the same people with the: 'Snatch a Kiss, or vice versa' and 'cummin stroke this' stickers on their trucks. ***** pig headed red necked americans.

      I will never purchase an american made vehicle again in my life, they are poorly constructed to support the auto repair industry. German Engineering for the mother ***** win!
      • Hodr, on 05/12/2008, -0/+0I know this is anecdotal, but my friend bought a Jetta two years ago and it has been in the shop at least 5 times. Everything from engine mounts (from all freeway traffic, nice!) to blown gaskets. Meanwhile, my 10 year old 210k mile Dodge Neon (ok, also a girly car) still gets 30-34 miles per galon and has NEVER been in the shop (lost a fuel pump, the fan relay, and popped a fuse once - total repair time for all of these problems was still under an hour).

        In any case, I am not too impressed by German engineering as it applies to VW's (Jettas specifically).
    • Scrappy1850, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2its not a cabrio... jettas arent bad
    • Dustyb, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Jettas are great cars, my brother, dad and I all have one and we race them on the weekends at local events... along with a lot of other VW drivers. Don't let some redneck let you believe that they are a chick car.
  • claybodie, on 05/10/2008, -4/+17If VW would only warranty more than a 5% biodiesel blend...
    • maddvibe, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Yes if only! I've ran bio in mine since 2002 when it was brand new with no problems at all in the 6 years since. Of course this engine is a different beast than mine.
    • Picaroon, on 05/10/2008, -14/+3Whoa whoa whoa... isn't biodiesel the one (at least in the US) made from corn? Didn't we already decide that corn-based fuel is a bad thing?
      • WiLLGT09, on 05/10/2008, -0/+7i think you thinking of ethanol fuel. maybe the biodiesel currently is mostly from corn also, but there are other plant sources that are easier to make biodiesel.
      • Artimusbill, on 05/10/2008, -0/+6You are thinking of Ethanol. And yes, ethanol produced from corn, or any of our food crops is a very bad thing.
      • themonkman, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2You can make biodiesel from almost anything that has any oil content. Soybeans, corn, animal fats, used vegetable oil, algae, peanuts, dead people, the wrappings from a Carl's Jr. Six Dollar burger, etc.
      • ricksite, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2Most biodiesel comes from soybeans.
  • Modestexcuse, on 05/10/2008, -10/+1That is amazing. It'll only get better people. Just wait to see what they innovate with that Web 3.0 thing they are all talking about.
  • Fangsinmybeard, on 05/10/2008, -9/+21There is no hope for the price of fuel to ever go back down ever. Look for alternatives now, before the oil companies start asking for your children as payment.
    • nomelitas, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2There is the option of locking down some of the oil producing countries. The Far East can't get oil they can't buy.
    • shadowmoose, on 05/10/2008, -2/+4$4.06 a gallon now. I remember when people were getting pissed at 2 dollars a gallon. Needless to say I ride my bike more then drive my truck now.
      • Ryosen, on 05/24/2008, -0/+1Clearly, they weren't getting pissed enough.
    • TruthKid, on 05/10/2008, -2/+1If children are acceptable payment, can't we just make more babies?
    • reddikilowatt, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2OK, but remember the 1970s and what happened to oil prices after in the 1980s. There is a lot of speculation built into the price of oil right now. When the gamblers find a new hot tip of the day, it will drop, although not likely to $20.

      And if it gets bad enough, all we have to do is open up some of the areas off the coasts of FL and CA to drilling. There's a lot of oil there, but right now it is too pretty to mess up.
    • joeanon, on 05/10/2008, -0/+5You must own oil stock.

      They just had that breakthrough in Lithium ion using nanoware anodes made by viruses to increase their capacity by 10 times. It's officially a major breakthrough in battery tech.

      The nice thing about electricity is it's diversity. Wind turbines and electric solar panels really are becoming practical measures for even a homeowner. Beyond that fuel cells can turn many fuels straight to electricity with minimal pollution and higher efficiency than a combustion engine.

      The only place where fossil fuel really does well is heating, because well ... it burns well. Designs like boilers are quite efficient with 85% efficiency. Unfortunately nobody ever came up with a real trick on how to convert heat or explosions into forward force in modern transport beside the turbine thruster.

      I think we should have taken more time looking at the turbine thruster since it's efficiency is so much higher than internal combustions.

      In the short term the first wave of PLUG IN hybrids will prove how much cheaper electric cars can be for most drivers.

      So gas is awesome, which is why in the long run I see biofuel as the solution because it's basically a form of battery when you combine it with fuel cells and also a good transition fuel for the diesel industry to lower transport costs immediately.

      I would couple non cropland biodiesel production with the lithium ion batteries and produce highly efficiency and longer laster transport than combustion, which is just privative when you step back and look at it.
      Low gas costs have killed innovation in transport. Although diesel trains are a good example of fact that hybrid designs make more sense than combustions (since modern trains are electric engines with on board diesel generators). However, rolling resistance on rails vs tires means you can carry all that weight without taking as much of a hit in fuel economy or larger engine needs.

      Anyway, trains do it, cars can to. The electric design is more efficient and MUCH longer lasting, How long can something realistically run while containing a mind boggling series of tiny internal explosion through out it's working lifespan. Explosion vs magnetism ... hmm which engine is going to last longer. PLUS electric engines DON'T NEED TRANSMISSIONS.

      We've been had on the electric car, the reality is, it would last too long.

      Now you even have electric cars that can run entirely on on board gas generators.

      A LAWN MOWER engine can run your electric engine up to 50 mph. So, scale that up and the auto industry should have switched us over to some type of high efficiency electric generator that driven and electric engine instead of well timed explosions, which is just dumb when you stop and think about it. Mostly however, it's wasteful.

      For the last century our cars have been expelling 70-80% of their fuel as wasted heat. The 20% gets converted to your tires. THATS why there is a fuel crisis and THATS why no matter what fuel type we use we have to get off the inefficient internal combustion.

      We must demand the engines last and likely contain fewer moving parts all together to increase longevity.

      The new 10z lithium ion will make this a reality and will push everyone toward hybrid technology thus causing much investment in those fields and perpetuating more MPG.

      However, we should always look at the basic efficiencies of transport not the simplistic ratings and transport that runs on a diverse energy which can be generated from multiple sources like electric is most ideal.

      In the longer term super capacitors or ultra capacitors will also use nano tech to soon unleash the complete next generation most likely bypassing all lithium ion limitations and offering faster charge and a very long life cycle that doesn't degrade much if at all.

      SO.. electric transport is the future, hybrids will only become more popular.

      Couple the TDI engine on a smaller scale to generator electric and add a lithium ion pack and this thing might get 120 mpg ... since diesel is more efficiency and TDI is among the best internal combustion.
  • DeskFlyer, on 05/10/2008, -7/+32VWTDIFTW
  • cl2yp71c, on 05/10/2008, -2/+13*Puts on shopping list*
  • Slices, on 05/10/2008, -3/+2hot wheels!
  • Bleach90, on 05/10/2008, -1/+22TDI amazing as always
    • c0un7, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1I dunno, TDI is pretty antiquated these days. Most other automotive companies are switching to second generation common rail in their diesel engines, and TDI *still* has pumpe-duse on some models. The hp-per-litre value is significantly lower in VW diesels than in those of other manufacturers, and because of the TDI architecture, their diesels still sound like tractors. I'm not disputing that VW makes good cars, but their diesels are hardly hitech. They have only recently started to be Euro-5 compliant in the EU, while other manufacturers have had Euro-5 emmissions standards capable engines for years.

  • sb07, on 05/10/2008, -5/+46honda civics and toyota corollas are great...but vw tdi technology just beats them in every way
    • mikehrp, on 05/10/2008, -12/+11Everything else about VW sucks though.
      • Phucked, on 05/10/2008, -5/+6VW has a cool Euro style and good handling but they break down way too much! Volkswagens are among the least reliable cars on the road
      • bigred, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2I'd agree with you on the older Volkswagens, everything up to about 2004. Since then they have had a fairly good track record and the New Rabbit/Golf/GTI actually earned consumer reports best in class rating. I think VW is at least trying to turn around their image and quality/reliability. They have burned a lot of people though in the past, so it will be hard to do (me included, I've put $8000 into my car that I spent $7800 on - how much of that was the previous owner, I'm not sure, but I'm guessing a lot).
        • borninda818, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1One thing about the GTI, god forbid you hit the bottom of the front bumper anywhere. You can say bye bye to your intercooler.
        • OdinEye, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1You have to be very careful with Consumer Report's ratings. They can recommend a car for a couple of years, and then later "de-list" and no longer recommend it as they get more information on it. They've done this in a number of cases - sort of a "oh - sorry you bought it when we said it was good - we know it sucks now..." approach.
      • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -1/+3Ever own one?
        We've had three.
        '73 Beetle (rusted apart), '99 Golf TDI (sold when I went back to school for an advanced degree), '01 Golf 2.0 (still driving 100k+ miles on it and going strong).
        I know it's not every VW ever made but really, the three we've had have treated us VERY well.
      • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Ugh. Don't get me started on the electricals of VDub.
    • jakbqwic, on 05/10/2008, -2/+0yes.. we be on dee same wavelength but but but due to my experience with VW servicing and mechanicals i find i'm selling mine soon as. The roads over here are pure ***** for a variety of reasons so i don't get to enjoy the ride much at all, so i'm down trading for guess what?.. an old toyota corolla, yeah!
  • sh4rkb1t3, on 05/10/2008, -10/+4If only it didn't keep you celibate...
  • Bhatch514, on 05/10/2008, -4/+4AdBlue is Urea, or a big tank of piss that is then inject into your exhaust stream onto a SCR catalyst. systems are big forward develop for heavy duty and off road vehicles for 2010. I am working on such a system at work with active particulate filters also.
    • Rbstr, on 05/10/2008, -0/+5The TDI jetta doesn't need the AdBlue, It uses a particulate filter and an NOX catalyst.
      The AdBlue systems are mainly for larger diesels.
      • Bhatch514, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Your right the Toureg uses the ADBlue system. The TDI and hte TSX uses lean nox trap.
    • ae92, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2Yeah, although their V6 version of the same technology will be big enough to warrant a urea tank, apparently. Luckily, I'd rather haul the wife, kid, and a pile of groceries around in a Jetta Sportwagen than in a Tiguan (an African word meaning "and you thought the Toureg had a silly name").
  • codyman, on 05/10/2008, -10/+8Put it in the rabbit... then maybe I'll buy it.... but jetta... negativo on that one, sir
    • vuke69, on 05/10/2008, -2/+14WTF is wrong with a Jetta?
      • OffPiste, on 05/10/2008, -11/+3If you have to ask then you'll never understand.

        Go ahead buy a Jetta. (snicker, giggle)
        • vuke69, on 05/10/2008, -3/+13Homophobe much?

          What are you guys like 12 ***** years old? "Oh, I'm not going to buy one of THOSE cars, I had a friend once that said only gay guys own them."

          Oh, and BTW, I drive a Subaru, AND like to eat pussy. Coincidence?... I think not.
          • OffPiste, on 05/10/2008, -2/+4giggle.
          • TruthKid, on 05/10/2008, -1/+8So lets see, jetta owners love guys, subaru owners love to eat pussy, and van owners love children. Got it
          • vuke69, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2TruthKid, that was a reference to the similarities of what is said about Jetta owners and what is said about Subaru owners. (Jetta:Gay::Subaru:Lesbian)
          • Thefascist, on 05/10/2008, -5/+2Vuke, you just gave yourself away, straight guys don't eat pussy, they ***** pussy, YOU ARE GAY ... and *****.
          • TruthKid, on 05/10/2008, -2/+2Vuke69 it just goes to show Subaru sells wagons and not vans because the market for Lesbian Pedophiles is much smaller then for just standard pedophiles.
        • peestandingup, on 05/10/2008, -1/+5Just how small is your penis??
      • balthisar, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Below average reliability, according to Consumer Reports and all of the survey people. Not a dig against VW... averages have come way, way up in the last few years.
      • digitalunit, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2EVERYONE owns one. And Rabbits/GTI's are way cooler. ;)
    • cheesypasta, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3How about a Golf hybrid-electric diesel instead?
      http://gas2.org/2008/03/03/a-biodiesel-prius-vw-to ...
      • insllvn, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Because Hybrid cars require massive strip mining and run up a carbon footprint (from shipping materials for the battery around the globe several times) that make a Hummer look like a bicycle? You would need to drive your Prius for 50 years to negate the effects of mining the nickel in northwestern America, shipping it to refining plants in Europe, and then to wherever the cars are assembled, and finally to wherever you are that you are buying the car.
      • djk21108, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1It's as if metal from conventional cars isn't mined, shipped, processed, and shipped. I think your 50 year figure is a little off my man.
        • insllvn, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3I was mistaken. I did a little research, and apparently the figures and info I remembered reading has were disproved as an urban legend by the likes of MIT and Argon National Labs. So, my bad, I will henceforth stop all hybrid bashing.
    • Shalaby, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1I had a 2006 Jetta that burst into flames while my sister was using it (apparently wiring issue with the rear defog),vw replaced it with a 2008 rabbit. I'm much happier with it.

      Don't the current Jetta and the Rabbit share the same engine?
      Why wouldn't they offer a rabbit blue?
  • nizzy1115, on 05/10/2008, -4/+8I can haz?
  • tifosiuno, on 05/10/2008, -2/+6I would like one please, dark blue.
  • MasterChi, on 05/10/2008, -4/+20That'll be great. Unfortunately without proper advertisement people will still be buying the Prius even though it gets less MPG then this.
    • Phucked, on 05/10/2008, -8/+1Yeah people are gonna buy a Toyota over a VW because V'dubs are the least reliable cars sold in America!

      http://www.volksbloggin.com/2006/11/14/consumerrep ...
    • jm1234567890, on 05/10/2008, -1/+3A prius would get better MPG in a city
    • kevinwiz, on 05/10/2008, -1/+6well diesel fuel costs more
      • borninda818, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1That's right now. It may go down in the future.
      • OdinEye, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1The cost of the fuel is only part of the picture - you gotta do the math. If the fuel costs 5% more, but the car gets 15% better fuel economy than it's gas competitors, you still save 10% over the competition.
  • greenlight2001, on 05/10/2008, -6/+5You know why Maine has such strict emissions.... because we're trying to compensate for all the ***** pollution coming in from the west! Damn jet stream... You guys make it, we end up breathing it.
    • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -1/+3...you do know that california is the most strict state as far as emissions go, but it is also the largest most populous state in the west.
      • Chandon, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3You do know that there's stuff west of Maine that's a hell of a lot closer than California, right? States like Illinois even have industrial stuff in them.
  • OffPiste, on 05/10/2008, -15/+2Now if only we could get decent drivers to own Jettas.

    Why is it that the guy who cuts you off, fails to use his turn signal, speeds excessively, talks on the cell phone while driving, passes on the right, or fails to keep in the right hand lane after passing, drives a Jetta?
    • pencilneck, on 05/10/2008, -2/+9Huh? Cars don't make for ***** drivers... some people are just ***** drivers no matter what kind of car they are in.
      • OffPiste, on 05/10/2008, -4/+2Huh? Are you able to read? I didn't say the car makes you drive poorly, I inferred that poor drivers own Jettas.
    • AngelBunny, on 05/10/2008, -2/+2this is going to sound terrible especially because I'm female but like 90% of jetta owners are females so if that gives you any idea of who you're categorizing...
    • IllBeBack, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Your generalization, while mildly humorous, is not valid. Everybody does this, especially if they have some ginormous SUV to cut you off with.
    • antonio97b, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2It's only the women.
  • gl77, on 05/10/2008, -7/+2i dont know if i am just ***** nuts or what but i remember when i first started seeing commercials for the Prius and those commercials boasted 70 mpg highway. now everyone is creaming themselves over 60 mpg.
    • cheesypasta, on 05/10/2008, -1/+7The base Prius averages 44 mpg in real world driving. Who knows what this Jetta will really get.
      • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Likely better based on real world TDI results that are already out there.
    • TruthKid, on 05/10/2008, -1/+13I believe those 70mpg numebrs were assuming you were driving in a vacuum on a 50 degree day when jupiter and saturn were in line with the sun.
    • gl77, on 05/10/2008, -5/+3im not saying they were right or wrong, but i remember a commercial for one that claimed 70 mpg.
      and im pretty sure cars have been getting 45 mpg since the late 70's or before, this is nothing new, but it seems that everyone is jumping on the "hybrid" bandwagon for cars that get the same mpg. and wasnt there a guy in the 70's that made a carburetor that gave a car 200 mpg but never got it into production?
      regardless though, 60 mpg is noteworthy.
      • gl77, on 05/10/2008, -0/+5i realize that this post was moronic after i posted it. please bury.
  • bxbomber, on 05/10/2008, -2/+2Any word on the price, i'm looking for a new car and depending how much this one costs I might pull of buying one until this one comes out.
    • balthisar, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2Made in Germany, a Euro country. In other words, overpriced for what you get.
    • pileofstraw, on 05/11/2008, -0/+1stick with your Chevrolet Cobalt and feel good about what you miss :)
  • dizilbdog, on 05/10/2008, -2/+38Let's hope VW can change the views of stupid American's who think diesels are just big busses which spew big black smoke. Diesel has come along way, and I think have a diesel engine turbo charged with some battery power is a much better package than a Toyota Prius.
    • balthisar, on 05/10/2008, -5/+3Until recently, the last time I'd driven in Europe was back in 1993, and so I was looking forward to experiencing "today's European diesels." They still stink -- not as badly, but you smell it everywhere in the cities. At highway speeds, it sounds and drives like a gasoline engine, but in the city, at lower speeds (and especially at idle), you still hear and feel the typical diesel rumble. Given that, I got 38 US mpg in a full sized friggin' station wagon, while driving the hell out of it. Despite the stink and roughness, I want one!
      • balthisar, on 05/10/2008, -2/+2Dugg my comment down for honesty about the downsides, despite the fact that I endorsed diesel at the end?
        • borninda818, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2They claim the new ones take care of that problem and a few reviews have stated that there is no smell and that the rumble is very light and only at very low rpm.
  • IC3M4N5, on 05/10/2008, -31/+4VW = junk
  • Pinkertinkle, on 05/10/2008, -8/+2Yeah guess they didn't see the price of diesel going through the roof.
  • Papajohn56, on 05/10/2008, -5/+4I hate this gas 2.0 site. Horrible design
  • southwo9, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2anyone have any idea what this thing will cost?
    • agarc, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2The price will probably be similar to what the 2.0T model costs. Fully loaded, you're looking at the low 30s (USD). It will also be in very high demand, so it will likely be difficult to negotiate below MSRP.

      They're going to have to package this model very carefully, otherwise it will be too expensive for many.
      • tnvwboy, on 05/12/2008, -0/+1It's not VW you have to worry about it's the dealers. Because TDIs fly off the lots, they'll likely throw lots of 'extras' onto the cars at the dealership to squeeze a few thousand more out of buyers.
  • Zandarrr, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1If only diesel prices were at least even with gas prices. I'm sure you'd still save money in the long run though.
    • MixMastaKooz, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2yea, at 60mp and 5 bucks a gallon, it's two cents cheaper per mile if you car gets 33mpg and $3.50 a gallon for regular.
  • Ipfreeley, on 05/10/2008, -5/+4Mini Cooper D series by bmw... 64.2 mpg...and it is one of their cleanest fossil sipping vehicles...
    • 0260, on 05/10/2008, -0/+7thats european cycle of testing mpg. US mpg is always less
  • Ghoztt, on 05/10/2008, -17/+260 MPG? Pfffff- What a nice little lie.
    www.whokilledtheelectriccar.com
    'nuff said.
    • raz98, on 05/10/2008, -0/+6is not a lie, I have this engine in the Skoda Octavia, is basically the same car. You can get 60mpg (~4 liters/100km ?) but only outside towns if you keep your car constant at 90-100km/h or so. I even manage to get 3.5liters/100km one time. But I usually don't drive this way, also here where I live we have more busy roads and not so much highways and I have to overtake all the time, but my consummation is around 5.4/100km which is not bad at all considering the conditions.
  • Baskins, on 05/10/2008, -3/+13Dear car manufacturers,
    Oh, I see. So you ~do~ have the ability to make vehicles with reduced emissions while at the same time increasing mileage. Feel free to stop whining and get yourselves into the 21st century already.
    • MisterWhite, on 05/10/2008, -5/+1By switching to a fuel with higher energy content? Do you know what you're talking about?
      • Baskins, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Considering the average MPG for the previous TDI version of the Jetta was ~40mpg, I'd say so. In other words, old diesel to new diesel = cleaner AND ~50% more efficient. I.e. - can.....be.....done. But you can continue to assume it was meant as a comparison of petrol vs. diesel if it makes you feel better.
        • MisterWhite, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2We'll see when the EPA numbers come out vs. marketing hype. The quote in the article is probably referring to imperial gallons which are about 20% more than US gallons.
  • raz98, on 05/10/2008, -1/+6I have this engine in my Octavia which is basically the same car, although I don't have the particle filter. It's a pretty fun engine to drive, it has a a huge amount of torque (320NM) early, from 1750rpm.The DSG gearbox is a dream, although the 6 manual speed gearbox is also good. And after you get tired of the 140bhp, you can easily tune your engine (a simple reprogramming of the ECU), to 170 bhp and 400NM, and be in the safe zone (clutch and turbine safe).
  • schoate09, on 05/10/2008, -2/+160 MPG manual or auto? ~65 manual would be sweet.
  • DeFex, on 05/10/2008, -3/+3They have had this tech for ages. do you think its a coincidence that modern aerodynamic lightweight cars get the same mileage as the old POS from the 70s? they could probably be at 100mpg by now.
    • MisterWhite, on 05/10/2008, -0/+4They have not had the technology to do this and still meet emissions standards until now (actually later this summer). 70s cars that got decent mileage had crap for HP.
  • Elamen, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2But its not 2009 yet!

    /sarcasm
  • NoPis10, on 05/10/2008, -0/+12I'm actually a driver in the new series that just started that uses these cars. It will be broadcast on speedtv in the fall. The cars are a blast and the motors are completely stock. Even on the track during the race we were getting 25mpg when most race cars don't do better than the single digits. For more info go to http://www.vw.com/vwhype/motorsport/en/us/#/jetta_ ...

    btw, still looking for a sponsor to cover the entry fee into the series. I'm Adam Love and this is my first time ever racing w2w. Didn't do too badly for my first race. Next one is next weekend and it's in canada.
  • djdingo, on 05/10/2008, -16/+5A new Jetta with better gas mileage?

    Lesbians rejoice!
    • lobstermobster, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Hey! I'm straight and I would totally sport this car, 60 MPG!!!!! are you kidding me? Why do we even use gasoline anymore?

      Diesel Hybrid anyone...?
  • URnotheonly1, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3$2.90 a gallon IN CHINA
    • AngeloM3, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3As of April 3rd 2008 Iraq was paying $1.36 a gallon........ couldnt find a more recent figure.
  • DieselGrunge, on 05/10/2008, -7/+1Mexican reliability ftw. Oh wait...
    • lukemann, on 05/10/2008, -3/+0Everyone I know who has a jetta has problems. Both electrical and engine. Mexican quality FTW.
      • agarc, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3You're an idiot who doesn't know what they're talking about. The Puebla, Mexico plant is one of VW's most technologically advanced manufacturing centers. All Jettas are built there.
        VW has a plant here (as well as in South America) because labor costs are much cheaper.
        I'm sick of all the racist comments about VW's quality ratings being attributed to Mexican labor. Will people feel the same way when they reopen a plant in the US?
        Quality control problems are usually due to external suppliers.
        • DieselGrunge, on 05/10/2008, -1/+0Theres nothing racist about this. Mexican isn't even a race....
          Just compare the reliability records of the Beetle, Golf, and Jetta to the Passat or Touareg.
    • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Because robots in factories care so much about the continent their on...
      • DieselGrunge, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Oh yeah I forgot VW doesn't have any Human employees anymore.
    • jj2me, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1It's a popular misconception to blame the assembly line workers. It's the engineers who design in the problems-in-waiting.

      Back in the heyday of complaints about American workers and praise for Japanese workmanship, Toyota built the Numi plant in California to produce the Chevrolet Prism (I think it was Chevrolet before it became a Geo), which was a Toyota Corolla under the skin. Quality of both was identical according to Consumer Reports, with maybe an insignificant edge to the American-made Prism.
  • yourpaljasper, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1what's this gonna cost?
  • Barackalypse, on 05/10/2008, -6/+4Since diesel is about 15% more expensive than regular unleaded, this translates to a gasoline powered vehicle getting roughly 52 mpg. Still impressive, but you're better off buying a Civic at 45 mpg and investing the 2-4 grand you save. Driving 10k miles a year the Jetta would save you less than 25 gallons of gas a year over the Civic (again adjusting for gas and diesel price differences).
    http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.as ...
    • MrFoof82, on 05/10/2008, -1/+9This is not intended as a flame, but...

      45mpg in a Civic? Seriously?

      Hear me out. After my Evolution VIII MR was reduced to a mangled pile of aluminum by a stoplight runner, I listened to family and friends for some stupid reason. I bought a Toyota Corolla, since they all had one (seriously, I had the gaudy looking thing with the carbon fiber spoiler that looked like it was being ganged up on on Corollas at family gatherings). They all said "omgmileage" and "reliability" and such enough that I took their advice and bought the automobile equivalent of a toaster.

      So in theory the thing is supposed to get an average of 35mpg highway. At normal sane human speeds. And as much as I tried to flatten acceleration curves, and to sit in the right-most lane at 62mph... it could only manage 33mpg. You could get 35mpg if you dropped your speed to more around 57mph, but in a 65mph zone with 4 lanes of angry massholes, even staying in the right-most lane would risk angry stares from nonagenarians.

      Of course, if I flogged the car and cruised at 80-85mph, took ramps at 65mph with the cruddy OEM Goodyear Integrity tires howling (what a godawful tire, btw), it'd get 30-31mpg.

      It was an 08. My father claimed his 02 got around 38mpg if he drove it in a geezerly fashion. It got more around 33-34mpg if he pretended he was still street racing in his old Chevy Nova. Of course his car weighs around 200 or 250lbs less, so that likely explains it all.

      So assume I got a Civic EX 5spd instead. 1 more gear than the gutless slushbox. And 50 pounds lighter. Unless the engine is only turning over at 1800rpm at 65mph -- which is what I'd expect out of a 4-literish V8, not a 1.8L inline-4 -- I fail to see how I might get better than... 36 or 37mpg.

      As for the Corolla, I ditched it after 6 months and 9000 miles. It was a pleasure writing in another $2500 on my downpayment on an MX-5 to rid myself of the inequity. And since my apartment lease was up, I now live 5 miles from work instead of 58 miles, and get 25mpg beating the living daylights out of my roadster.

      The only people I know getting 45mpg out of their cars while drumming on them? Friends with older 02 or 03 Jetta/Golf TDIs get close to that with heavy right feet. 48 if one drives like an old man.
      • Moiax, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1http://automobiles.honda.com/civic-hybrid/
      • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3I'm one of those folks that got 45 mpg out of a '99 TDI myself. Believe me, I didn't drive like an old man.
        • pirategaspard, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1I don't drive like an old man either, and I get 40-45 without trying.
      • borninda818, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Good Choice on the MX-5. It's not much under the hood but it handles like a scares jackrabbit and has ample modding potential.
    • jackspayed, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2lol @ "automobile equivalent of a toaster."
      I also had a Corolla - but in XRS trim... ONLY corolla worth buying...
    • pcrow, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1Diesel is more expensive in the US right now, but I was under the impression that over the long term, it tends to be cheaper. The problem right now is related to short-term refinery issues.
  • thegreatgazoo, on 05/10/2008, -3/+5The problem (at least in the US) is that VW has really taken it in the shorts with quality. Our accountant at work had a earlier diesel bug which died at about 150k, so she traded it in on a newer one that she gave up on at 60k miles. The maintenance and repairs on them are just crazy, and could quickly outpace the gas/diesel savings.

    Mercedes is kind of the same way. A friend has a diesel e300 that has had nothing but problems.

    And the bonus is that if it does break down, a lot of mechanics don't know anything about diesels, so if you are east bumfark (insert state), you're kind of hosed if you break down.

    I hope it is a great car. But being that it is new technology from a poor quality manufacturer, I have my doubts.
    • danielttt, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2She needs to change the oil and the timing belt is critical. Your anecdotal experience is rather meaningless. VW and Mercedes have reasonably good reputations.. Diesel mechanics are not that rare. Car manufacturers and their engineered products become more and more esoteric evey year. Take you Chevy into a Ford shop sometime. The way each car is unique, all of them require specialized training. VW and Mercedes us no different regardless of the engine. Diesel is really, in many ways, simpler than gasoline engines....No spark plugs to fowl and no ignition wiring to fail.. Oh and, by the way, there's someone who works at your company who's a liar, a thief, and cheats on his wife ... that's just the kind of people they hire...
    • JohnboiWaltune, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Jettas, unlike other VW vehicles, are made in Mexico. This is so that VW does not have to pay high German wages to get the cars built. So you are still getting German engineering, but Mexican quality control. What this means: if you buy a Jetta, pray you don't get one made on a Friday afternoon.
  • KyjL, on 05/10/2008, -4/+3I'd bite if they stop making them in Mexico and finally start importing them from Germany.
    • earlycj5, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3yeah, the robots in the factories care which continent their on.
      I have yet to see any conclusive statistical proof that this real.
    • UrlorJkron, on 05/10/2008, -0/+4Actually they are planning on putting a plant here in the states. From what I've read it's probably going to be in Alabama or Tennessee.
  • seandaly, on 05/10/2008, -5/+22I know...

    1/2 of you boys are saying "geeez, that's pretty cool, but I don't produce nearly enough estrogen to own a Jetta" while the other 1/2 is saying "yeah, 60mpg is sweet but diesel is going to be a million dollars a gallon by summer, so it doesn't matter".
    The big thing to remember here is that a diesel can be made to run on practically any oil, which means bio-diesel and blends could seriously bring the cost down. While the standard oil refining process produces 2X gasoline vs diesel per barrel of oil, they can shift that towards diesel if demand rose.
    As cool as this is, I'd rather see VW take some of the TDI clean technology and apply it to a 25hp diesel designed to run at 3600 RPM for hours at a time (generator engine) and build a real plug-in / series hybrid. There are some generators out there producing close to 8Kw and while sipping just over 1/2 gallon of diesel per hour. With Lithium Ion batteries, it's not unrealistic to see ranges of 200 miles per charge on an all eclectic vehicle not unlike what we buy today (not Tesla). Add a 7500 watt Diesel generator in the mix and we might see the range extended by another 60 to 100 miles, yet burn less than a gallon of diesel (or insert your preferred oil here). Stuff a slightly larger generator in there and we could see 250 + 150 extended ranges while burning less than 2 gallons of diesel.

    Quit being obsessed with raw power people.
    First - formal relationship. On paper, one horse power equals 736 watt. So, say 200 hp amounts to 147,200 watts, or ~147 kW. This, however, doesn't mean you need 147 kW electric motor for your car to perform the same as 200 hp gasoline counterpart, and this is why: The power of ICE (Internal Combustion Engines) are always specified at max horse power (or kW) it can produce at the best spot - certain RPM, let say 3000 RPM. Maximum power is almost never achieved because engine does not spend any length of time running at 3000 RPM at full power (unless you clime up a steep hill), you will certainly accelerate. So typically the RPM ramps up from ~500 RPM to ~5000 RPM, thus having peak power output just for a fraction of second when crossing 3000 RPM mark. To cruise with steady speed on a freeway it takes about 12 hp and the only reason we have 200 hp engines is to be able to accelerate or pass quickly.
    So, the vast majority of the time your 200 hp engine really runs at 12 hp. If you ask what *average* power an ICE engine makes in a usable RPM range, it will be about 30-40 hp for 200 *peak* hp engine.
    In contrast, electric motors are always rated at maximum continuous power output, say 30 kW (which is 40.8 hp). The motor can output peak power at least 5 times of it's rated power (if supplied with enough energy), so a 30 kW motor can give you 150 kW (or 203 hp) for acceleration or passing. So in a first approximation 30 kW motor will give you at least the same performance as a 200 hp engine in the same car. Essentially, electric motors are better because they develop full torque instantly right from the start (0 rpm) while ICE do not make any power until the shaft ramps up to at least 500 RPM. So as a rough rule of thumb, an ICE engine with X hp power will equate to the electric motor with X/4 hp electric motor rating. In this example, a 200 hp engine (making 30-40 hp average) will need to be replaced with 200/4=50 hp motor. Since 1 hp is 0.736 kW, 50 hp motor is 50*0.736=36.8 kW. Now, imagine sticking a few decently sized 10kW super-capacitors in mix and you have all the power you could ever want available, yet the ability to optimally use as little energy as required when driving economically.
    It's all out there, we're just waiting for someone to combine it, run it through real R&D and give us a usable product.

    In the meantime, I'd settle for one of these Jetta's :)
    • AngeloM3, on 05/10/2008, -3/+6Anyone have Cliff Notes for this comment?
    • balthisar, on 05/10/2008, -4/+0It's a good comment, but isn't automobile horsepower measured at the wheels? Or is that just hot-rod geeks that measure on the dyno?
      • Dachublez, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3Most advertised ratings are at the crank. You can expect a 20-40% loss of power in the drive train before reaching the ground(wheel HP) depending on your drive train configuration.
    • getrealnow, on 05/10/2008, -5/+2wall of text
      • lacronicus, on 05/10/2008, -1/+7It's what smart people like to call a "knowledgeable post."
        • getrealnow, on 05/13/2008, -1/+2Or can't use the return key
          • seandaly, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1I used the return key... My comment had carriage returns before and after I submitted it. It was only once the "edit comment" timer ran out and I reloaded the page did I notice that the comment system somehow removed all of my paragraph formatting.

            Thanks for pointing it out to us though...
  • 0260, on 05/10/2008, -0/+9now a diesel rabbit, please
  • iMoth, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2VW 4 life
  • Barbarino, on 05/10/2008, -8/+7The Volt is the end all of this cat and mouse game. In 2 years you'd be an idiot to be owning this Jetta instead of the Volt...
    • mos6507, on 05/10/2008, -2/+3Except that the Volt will be over $40,000.
      • carlosos, on 05/10/2008, -0/+2Where did you get that number? As far as I know the goal was between 20-30K while many expect the price to be between 30K and 40K but not above that.
  • dbzssj44676, on 05/10/2008, -11/+3Sensationalist *****
    This car would have to weigh less than 800 pounds to sport 60 mpg on such a low BTU fuel. It will get more like 40-45 mpg driving granny style down a hill.
    Besides, VW's are very expensive at any point. Would it really be worth trading in your current car adding price to the already expensive VW, just because you don't want shell to have your money. $25,000 (that would otherwise go to VW) gets you 6250 gallons of gas, at $4 per gallon. On a car that gets you 20mpg, you have a range of 125,000 miles.
    Do the calculations yourself, i have no idea how expensive this car really is, or what your current financial situation is like.
    • lobstermobster, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1diesel is a higher btu fuel than gasoline...
    • Dachublez, on 05/10/2008, -0/+5Also these cars already get ~60mpg real world driving. You may be unaware but loads of small diesel cars are sold in other countries. They just don't sell well in the states do to misconceptions that morons like you have.
    • pencilneck, on 05/10/2008, -0/+6I already get +50 MPG in an 2004 TDI Jetta if I keep a steady 65MPH on the highway. You don't own a VW TDI so you have no clue what you are talking about. I sure as hell don't granny style drive my car and with city driving I'm still getting 36MPG city.... other makes are bragging about getting 32MPG highway like it is some big deal... screw that.

      Also on the price point, VWs come with a LOT of standard features that other brands do as add-ons. So while the base price might be higher than say Mazda, by the time you bring another car up to the same level as the VW, it cost more than the VW. About the only options VWs have is cloth or leather interior, what color do you want and 3 different CD/radio choices.
      • dbzssj44676, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1I was referring to e85. Sorry i must have mixed the content of another article.
  • laurencedrell, on 05/10/2008, -7/+0Why doesn't anyone have the courage to say
    we are lowering the speedlimit
    and you are now going to get between 10-20% better mileage.
    And anyone who speeds really does get a big ticket
    and use that money to repair road in that community.
    But the mileage savings is incredible. Significantly lowering the speedlimit
    could save as much oil
    as comes thru the alaska pipeline daily.
    • mos6507, on 05/10/2008, -0/+3They'll have to lower the speed limit to 40mph to get people to actually drive 55.
    • Dachublez, on 05/10/2008, -0/+1This depends on the vehicle there is no one size fits all speed limit. My friends corvette gets its best fuel economy at ~70mph. Where he gets 36mpg. Almost as good as a prius and he has 410WHP. the point is do your research before making stupid comments or assuming someone else's car gets worse fuel economy than your car does. For the record it's a 97' C5 with heads cam and headers and all but open pipes out the back.
      • lacronicus, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Yeah, because 36 mpg is really close to the 55 mine averages...
        Seriously, though, if your friend insists on driving a corvette, he can deal with the gas prices. For everyone else, slower speeds reduce fuel costs.
  • jerbaker, on 05/10/2008, -7/+4Nice mileage. Too bad it's a VW. That's enough to prevent me from purchasing one, even if it got 100 mpg ... seriously. Sure, you save money on gas, but you're going to make up for that by taking it in to have random electrical problems repaired. I've experienced three Jettas from 1986 through 2000 model years. Once they started making them in Mexico, they went to serious *****.
    • agarc, on 05/10/2008, -1/+3No, they didn't. Quality has gone up over that time period. VW has taken many measures to improve overall quality. The 2009 model year now includes 3 years of free maintenance, and they've always had great warranties. I owned a Jetta from 2002-2006 and it was a great car with very few, minor problems (all covered quickly and easily by the warranty).
      Quality has nothing to do with Mexican labor!
      • jerbaker, on 05/11/2008, -0/+1The 1986 Jetta, made in then West Germany lasted over 200,000 miles. My 1995 Jetta had the plastic dials that control the heater melt and start smoking while I was driving. The rear door handles repeatedly would stop working and require a trip to the dealer to fix. One time the battery just died after about 18 months. Turned out to be a defective cell that had a hole in it. Then I was stupid enough to buy a 2000 Jetta. At 400 miles the entire instrument cluster had to be replaced. It took two days and the dealer refused to give me a rental. Then the heater stopped functioning and the dealer told me that the heater core was bad and it would take $1500 to repair. An independent shop fixed it for $200. Turns out the cable to the heater box door had just come off. Let's not even bring up that the thing ate oil at the rate of a quart per tank of gas. The dealer reported it as normal.

        I will never own a VW again ... ever. My mother also owned a Mexican-built 2002 Jetta that had a worse oil consumption problem. My father had a 2004 Passat from Germany that never had an issue - not even a lightbulb. I can't say whether it's because of Mexican labor, but the fact is that every VW built in Germany I have experienced never had a single issue and the ones built in Mexico were plagued with problems.
  • liljerk, on 05/10/2008, -8/+1have fun replacing your brake pads and rotors every 20k miles and calipers every 40k miles. after seeing the lemon of a jetta my sister bought a few years back i'll never buy VW, regardless of the gas mileage.
    • jhanson, on 05/10/2008, -1/+2I'm with you on that one. I had a 2000 Jetta, and it was the most unreliable car I've ever owned. It was in the shop for something at least once a month. It was everything from the power windows breaking (twice each, except the driver's one which broke 3 times), the CD changer shorting out and killing two radios (installed wrong by the dealership), pads and rotors at 20k, countless MAF sensors, a coolant temperature sensor, bad fuel injector, etc, etc.

      I ended up trading mine in at about 45k miles after one particularly bad month when I was only able to drive it 4 times. I was sick of having to hitch a ride from all the Toyota and Honda owners I worked with.
    • lashepherd, on 05/10/2008, -1/+1Yes sir! I have three friends who suffered through the same thing.
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