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Animal Instincts: Main Street Seeks Revenge on Wall Street

livescience.com — The outrage expressed by many so-called Main Street folks over the proposed Wall Street bailout is based on more than a sense of injustice. It's about revenge, and Washington politicians would be wise to listen up...

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  • EarlofSlander, on 10/02/2008, -1/+51Mmmmmm. Revenge sounds delicious right about now.
    • yoshman, on 10/03/2008, -1/+10I heard it's best when served cold.
      • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -1/+3with a side of flava beans...
      • RudeTurnip, on 10/03/2008, -1/+2I heard it's best served hard (see: The Crying Game).
    • radu79, on 10/03/2008, -1/+10Yes, it does, but in this particular case it's not just about revenge, it is also about the "why the ***** should I give those morons my money" factor. How about they get the bailout money by liquidating the assets (houses, cars, and even underwear) of those who were in charge and made millions?
      • Crimsoneer, on 10/03/2008, -3/+2I suspect it's because they've been making the American economy what it is for the last century or so.
      • radu79, on 10/03/2008, -0/+7That's not true, the American economy thrived because the people were hard working and produced a lot of goods which were exported all over the world. Of course, that's not the case now, which is one of the resasons for the recent events.
    • petaganayr, on 10/03/2008, -1/+1A cheese burger sounds delicious right now.
    • duke3k, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2The last politician should be hung with the guts of the last banker
    • Tbyrd073, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2http://digg.com/business_finance/House_Passes_Bail ...

      Not that it matter for revenge or no the bill passed the House of Representatives. Meaning now Bush just has to sign it which he will. Look out for the inflation.
    • brad3378, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Hey Mr. BabyMan
      Your Candidate voted for this ***** too.

      Any Comments?
    • sodade, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2Revenge? Nah. I want a punishment that will keep them or anyone else from ***** the american people again. Why don't they include a "trading places" clause? Absolute poverty would make these fatcats think twice.
  • tjordanchat, on 10/02/2008, -1/+35Got my attention. Let's stick it to them. We don't need anymore bricks in the Wall.
  • Edudris, on 10/02/2008, -1/+66I wouldn't call it revenge. I'd call it justice.
    • kemp34, on 10/03/2008, -1/+12Seriously. Something about a long train of abuses...
    • SquattingBear, on 10/03/2008, -2/+1Well, where I come from, it's called fairness, just simple fairness.

      /obligatory biden quote from lastnight's debate
    • serif69, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Dugg for great justice.
  • FrostedFlame, on 10/02/2008, -23/+8Revenge for what? Basing investment decisions on paterns that remained consistent for the previous 20 years? Extending credit to people that wanted to buy houses? Trusting rating agencies to properly rate the securities they were buying?

    Sometimes when you're having a rocky trip it's the fault of the driver and sometimes it's the fault of the road. The driver is always easier to blame.
    • cheezintern, on 10/03/2008, -7/+3Exactly. No one forced people to take out $0 down, variable rate mortgages to buy houses they otherwise could never afford.
      • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -3/+12Psst - that isn't what got you into this mess. Stop letting them frame the arguments on you...

        People buying houses with ***** credit are bad, but that would be a local, fairly small blip. What killed you was those mortgage lenders taking that ***** credit paper, repackaging it as great paper, and then selling that all around the world. That is criminal and that is why they are on the sling.

      • oldhick, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3@Waiting2awake... Haven't seen you around in a while, but SO true. I don't understand how so many people still can't understand the difference between a home owner defaulting on a mortgage and CDO's full of over-valued high risk loans being sold, insured, resold, reinsured...
        A home owner defaulting a mortgage is NOT the issue here.
      • elementop, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2*I* didn't take out a $0 down variable rate mortgage to buy a house I could otherwise never afford. *I* stayed in a modest $120,000 house that, until this summer, was worth $300,000+.

        However, because idiot mortgage lenders were trying to sell every loan they could, whether or not buyers were qualified, and because fly-by-night credit insurance companies were selling insurance to the lenders for the time when such borrowers would inevitably default on their loans -- without having the financial wherewithal to actually pay off these mortgages when the borrowers defaulted -- I, and everyone else in the country, am now looking at inflation, a s*****y job market, and an additional $800 billion dollars of national debt which my taxes -- if I am lucky enough to still have a job in two years -- will have to pay off.
      • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1OldHick - Been rather busy watching the markets tumble. I simply can't believe what is going on. I keep thinking to myself that Americans are suddenly going to realize that this is the biggest theft of American value in the history of the country and act.

        What I don't get is the relationship here. I got Enron, I saw the connections and people being people, kinda of figured they'd get off scott free. But Mortgage companies, Insurance companies, etc? I just didn't think they had that type of pull, that would make the Government do something that so readily could become volatile.

        Maybe they feel they have nothing to fear from the masses anymore?
    • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -0/+4In this case though the driver made the road....
    • radu79, on 10/03/2008, -0/+7No, not revenge for THAT! Revenge for being greedy ***** and giving people loans that they knew those people can't pay back. The idea was that the houses keep going up in price, so should they fail to pay, they will sell their houses and get their money back (and some more).
      While their game worked, and they made tens of millions a year (I am talking about their CEOs), they never came and said: Hey, Radu, we are doing so well, here, take 300 bucks.
      But now that they are not doing that well, they want about 300 bucks from me and every other American, and they are not asking nicely for the money.
      • NidStyles, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1I say we all spend about $300 on ammo, and then give it to them. ;-)
  • davidkeithjones, on 10/03/2008, -14/+5Really? Are people that ignorant to the way the market works?
    • disparue, on 10/03/2008, -1/+13Welcome to Econ 400. The upper year course where you learn the market isn't actually rational.
    • Taiyoryu, on 10/03/2008, -0/+5Are people that ignorant to the way people work? Economics is based on the predicate that people act rationally, but I've been around long enough to know that's not the case. (Buy on credit and treat your debt as a monthly expense? Cut taxes but don't cut spending? Buy the shiny bauble at the expense of some need?) No one says that taking a personal financial hit is a rational choice, but behavioral scientists have done experiments to show that people are willing to do so to exact revenge on someone who's betrayed them.
  • gwnyc, on 10/03/2008, -20/+9Its pretty funny how dig in general rips on Fox News all the damn time for being "Biased" but I can not honestly say I have ever seen a Pro-Mcain/Palin article on Digg, hypocrites.... and yet every day there are the same repetitive Palin articles that seem to give most of you a boner to Digg... seriously its not that i like Mcain...lol and really...i wouldent mind seeing some of the Republicans out there voice their opinions...maybe it would make Digg a little less one sided and all of the self righteous assholes that think their winning something every time they make some obvious pro-democrat comment and 5 people jump right on their dicks... common guys try to make it a little interesting in here....instead of the same old *****...thats all i ask...thanks

    G
    • enclaved, on 10/03/2008, -3/+7Diggs motto is not fair and balanced eh?


      And they do voice their opinions, the problem is most of them are so retarded you've most likely become accustomed to ignoring them.
    • ooby, on 10/03/2008, -3/+6Digg doesn't claim to be unbiased AFAIK.
    • Hetman, on 10/03/2008, -4/+9Digg is not ever going to be fair and balanced. That is because its users do not have to be. It is not a bad thing. It just the facts. It is like if you were to go to see a phish concert. How many conservatives do you really expect to be there?
      • Shaman760, on 10/03/2008, -2/+2My brother is a staunch conservative and a HUGE Deadhead/Phish fan. I'm not conservative and really can't stand Phish, so stick your stereotypes somewhere else. K thanxbai
    • robdiggity, on 10/03/2008, -2/+14Ask and you shall receive. I am a republican. I think GWB is the worst thing to happen to the US in 40 years, and the mere existence of his political and professional careers are a testament to the general dumbing down of middle America over the past 20. But that's a subject for another post.

      I very much thought McCain was the real deal 8 years ago. I am gravely disappointed in what he has become. This Palin business, aside from being an out and out embarrassment, is further evidence of the theory referred to above. Over the past 2+ years, after reversing his positions on just about every issue that made him admirable, I have come to realize more and more that I simply cannot vote McCain. He cemented this feeling for me with his ludicrous VP pick.

      I simply am not impressed by the choices we are reduced to. On the one hand I am told I am supposed to be filled with hope at the prospect of Obama & Biden. On the other hand I am told I am supposed to stand back and watch the mavericks "get it done" with McCain and Palin.

      I am not hopeful. Obama is a young politician, Biden and McCain are old politicians, and Palin is an imbecile. None of them, and I mean NONE of them speak at all about the single biggest existential threat this nation is facing, or will ever face: the crushing federal debt. We flat out owe over $11 trillion, half of which was accumulated over the past 8 years. We have made promises of another $40 trillion in entitlements due to our vast aging populace over the next 10-20 years. The fact that we have been fretting over another trillion in these past few weeks (like nobody saw it coming) sounds absurd. The fact that those Washington assholes wouldn't pass the first bail out because they needed more time to pack in their $180 billion in earmarks, while criminal, still sounds trivial in the face of a $50 trillion debt. Nobody talks about this. There is NOTHING more important than this.

      If you are American, and you are serious, there is really nothing else worth talking about. Your political party doesn't matter, your religion doesn't matter, your anger over this slight or that affront doesn't matter. We all owe.

      How is every other discussion not a god damned puppet show?
      • cdahlkvist, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2As a Republican I have been facing the same dilemma as you. Fortunately, you just brought me the answer.

        You are my write-in candidate.
      • NidStyles, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3Nice post. Any time you wish to run for any office let me know. I would support you.
      • robdiggity, on 10/04/2008, -0/+1That's Diggity with two Gs.
  • diggopolous, on 10/03/2008, -10/+8Be careful with revenge in the way of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
    • Snarfy, on 10/03/2008, -1/+20The banks are raping our kids and grand-kids with this bill. I'll lose a nose.
      • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -1/+10and anything else required to stop this insanity..
      • cdahlkvist, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Don't worry about the kids and grandkids quite yet. You need to watch your own ass since our government just ass-raped us today and plan to make it an all nighter - Oh, and they are inviting all their foreign friends to help with the gangbang of the American people.
    • elementop, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2If I could be sure that the only way to salvage the economy was to pass the bailout bill, I would be all for it. However, no one seems to know if the bailout will help. No one seems to know if there is any alternative. The best argument I have heard so far is "well, we've got to do *something*!!!" and quite frankly, that's not a good enough argument.

      I propose that we start by liquidating the assets of the crooks who got us into this mess in the first place, *then* we try to figure out what still needs to be done. Sell their multimillion dollar mansions. Sell their luxury cars. Pump *that* money back into the economy and then if the banks still need to be bailed out, we'll talk about it.
  • BillE3, on 10/03/2008, -1/+13We depend on the banking systems to process transactions and exchange the money. Because of this dependency most of us did not pay attention to the blatant profiteering conducted at every ones expense. We just took it in stride as part of business as usual. The banking system routinely raked in profits way beyond the profits of the oil and energy industries, yet no one said a word. It is about time they all went through a review and audit process. Weed out the ones that made profiteering a profession and not just a pastime hobby.
    • DutchGuilder, on 10/03/2008, -1/+95 years ago Wall Street accounted for 10% of all corporate profits. Last year they accounted 40% of all corporate profits. That just seems too high.
      • NidStyles, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3It's amazing that these people are making money out of nothing. Seriously do they produce anything of any value, or just fool around with other people's money.....
  • goodinohio, on 10/03/2008, -4/+18Democrats and Republicans all telling the same lies today.

    Vote Chuck Baldwin!
  • dreid1987, on 10/03/2008, -2/+42"Bring it on, many people seem to be saying. "

    My thoughts exactly. I'm willing to endure some economic pain if it means showing these assholes that they can't run away with our money.
    • brad3378, on 10/03/2008, -0/+8Anybody know where I can get a few truck loads full of Guy Fawkes masks?
      • NidStyles, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Why not do it the right way, and make one?
    • Waterrat, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1 Yeah they can. They have been running away with our money for years.
  • Chineseyes, on 10/03/2008, -9/+3If they think they are going to get "revenge" on the wealthy they are delusional. The wealthy ALWAYS get the last laugh here are a few ways they do this:

    We're going to have to let you go we can't afford to keep your division.
    We can't give you that loan, I know your credit is great and you've always made your payments to us on time but money is tight.
    Good news you've been approved for that short term business loan, you interest rate is 18%, congratulations.
    • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -0/+4You shouldn't have any fear....They can do all those things - and if you have defined you life by your job, your clothes, your stuff, then you are ***** as you suggest.....

      If however you have defined yourself by what you can do, what you have to offer not just corporations, but your fellow man - then there is no reason to fear.

      Might I suggest reading this for a good primer.
      http://digg.com/business_finance/Local_restaurant_ ...

      We, the people, are truly the power. Without us, nothing can get done.
      • OMGWTFROFLMAOx2, on 10/03/2008, -1/+2Unfortunately idealism doesn't keep the lights on or put food on the table.
      • NidStyles, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Apparently, reading and comprehending is not something you are able to do...
    • orbit1979, on 10/03/2008, -1/+7If your observations are correct, then that illustrates a much bigger problem with our society. It illustrates that the wealthy have the power of what can be boiled down to blackmail and coercion of the general public. That being the case, our society is in desperate need of major reforms to correct this dangerous injustice.
    • elementop, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Yeah, the French aristocracy said the same thing in the 1700s...
  • TreatsTheBear, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2Somehow I knew Dan Ariely would be mentioned in this article.

    Predictably Quotable?
  • diggopolous, on 10/03/2008, -6/+6Be careful with revenge in the way of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
    You want to stick it to "The Man" huh? Well, travel up to Greenwich Connecticut and slash some tires on some Bentleys would be more productive. Face it, "The MAN" is sailing off into the sunset on his yacht and few of "The Man" are going to get punished. Denying any corrective action or bailouts means you will be sticking to yourself. YOU won't get a student loan and YOU won't get mortgage relief, YOU will lose that job because of the credit crisis.
    And after you are done slashing those tires on those Bentley's you might want to move on to Main Street and slash the tires on Joe SixPack's SUV which he bought by using the his home equity as an ATM machine when his mortgage wasn't underwater. Just be careful about your own care and keep it in good shape because if corrective action is not taken YOU won't ever be gettting a car loan.
    • Hetman, on 10/03/2008, -2/+7I would rather deal with the problem now and get it over with. Instead of just delaying it, or worst causing hyper inflation which would ruin the dollar. I will take the sacrifice in my 20s in home that by my 30s the U.S. is a better place.
    • akatsuki, on 10/03/2008, -3/+3I am sure it is easy to dig down, especially by the ignorant masses of Digg who wouldn't know how to define a securitization tranche or what the difference between a credit crunch and a liquidity crisis are. Cause Diggers, much like the populace they like to make fun of, like to think they know it all.

      The whole exec comp thing is ***** peanuts compared to what the fallout from this will be. Sure, you may think the system is ***** from the beginning, and that it never should have happened, but, guess what, this is the system you live in, your friends live in, and that you will bear the consequences of. And while you may feel you can weather it out for a better future, I am sure your parents' pension plans and cash stored in their houses that they were counting on won't be a burden to you when they are out on the street without healthcare or the ability to buy food.

      There is too much ideology over reality here and Main Street and DC. The reality is that without the bailout everyone will suffer massively. With the bailout a couple of execs will make some amount of money off of you, and you will suffer a bit through a recession. Go ahead, screw Wall Street, and screw yourselves.
      • NidStyles, on 10/03/2008, -0/+4Reality is that people will learn to survive just like they did in the '30s. Some have no concept of what survival really is, survival doesn't require all of that stuff you listed. Those are LUXURIES.
      • akatsuki, on 10/06/2008, -0/+1Yeah... the 30s were this wonderful era of peace and prosperity for everyone... If that is all your ambition in life is, then great, go do it. Some of us would not like to have to boil shoe leather to get by. Civilization, culture, etc... require free time...
    • Hetman, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1I do not mean to be a cynic. But they stood their complacently and allowed this to happen. They should have to deal with it, instead of delaying the problem until I am in my 40s. It is going to take us a lifetime to undo what they have done.
    • LilRabbitFooFoo, on 10/03/2008, -1/+1*****. It just means the interest rate will be a fraction higher than it would have been because the banks would have been FORCED to eat the costs of their losses. Now, they get free money and go on as usual. How ***** up is that?

      This was one last gasp of graft before the game changes in November, pure and simple.
    • gnixon70, on 10/04/2008, -0/+1Ah the propaganda spin doctors are all over this trying to do damage control on this one.

      The fact of the matter is, we have been sold down the river by our politicians. If we have any resemblance of America left, we'll vote all these guys out of office that voted for this sham ass bill. I don't care if its between the guy who voted for this sham bailout bill or the antichrist. I would rather have the antichrist in office.

      Democrat, republican, doesn't matter, they all suck in my humble opinion. We need an option c and we need one freaking now!
  • brb1031, on 10/03/2008, -3/+11You know, I heard this same crap on NPR yesterday.

    The MSM needs some psychobabble BS to explain away the grassroots opposition to this bailout as being _emotional_ rather than _rational_ in nature.

    I think the truth for most people is that, once their own money is on the line, they wake up and start paying attention. Not that they give any care about whether a few CEO's run away with millions, this bill is about _hundreds of billions_ of our money.
  • destroboner, on 10/03/2008, -2/+5The federal government organizes the states into 13 commonwealths to try and ensure economic stability, but this only divides the U.S. as the commonwealths put their own ambitions before those of the nation as a whole. Tensions rise worldwide over the next century due to an increasing energy crisis caused by the rapid exhausting of petroleum reserves, leading to a war between Europe and the Middle East in 2052 as Middle Eastern countries drastically raise oil prices. In 2066, China invades the U.S. at Alaska for resources, and in 2077, the war reaches its climax with a devastating nuclear exchange between the two opposing countries, resulting in the post-apocalyptic world in which the game takes place. The exchange, lasting only hours, became known as the Great War; it is left unknown which side launched the first missile.

    the fallout series is coming true
    • Hetman, on 10/03/2008, -0/+4If we do not devolope alternative energies by 2052 we deserve to die.
    • RudeTurnip, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1It's cheaper to deploy an assload of solar panels and set up nuclear power stations than to wage war and dwindle down both your resources AND manpower.
  • thegreenspanput, on 10/03/2008, -2/+15"President Bush and other leaders who support the bailout warn, however, that if financial institutions are not propped up quickly and significantly with public money, the average American will pay the price."

    Bush is at his finest when he "warns".
    • kemp34, on 10/03/2008, -2/+13Bush's entire shtick has been THE BIG WARNING.

      One BIG WARNING after another, which then leads to MAJOR anti-liberty legislation.

      If George W. Bush ever voices the word "liberty" again in his life may he be struck down by lightning.
      • BigW, on 10/03/2008, -0/+6Isn't it funny how much the "urgency" on the bail-out resembles the "urgency" on the Iraq War Vote....
      • dondara, on 10/03/2008, -0/+4You can sell any kind of ***** if you throw in a side of fear.
      • Tbyrd073, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2Breaking News: George W. Bush struck by Lightning during White House Press Conference.
      • GovernmentSp00k, on 10/04/2008, -0/+3It's all BUSH *****. Scare the American dummies into complacency. Invoke fear, uncertainty, doubt. The best way to control and manipulate a populace. It worked wonders for their 9/11 fraud, it worked perfectly for their 2 Middle East war scams, it will work like a charm for their most recent deception, the great $700 billion dollar fleecing of willfully ignorant American taxpayer fools. They will never know what him 'em! We'll have our 4th estate propaganda arm of the US government "news" media do the rest. It's no longer a "bailout" bill' it's suddenly a "rescue plan!" America needs to be rescued!! Quick give us $700 billion dollars or you will lose everything! Your 401k will vanish! Why should anyone in their right mind buy what Shrub is selling? He's done nothing but lie in our faces at every possible opportunity. Along with the rest of his miserable sidekicks.

        Anytime the administration talks about "rescuing" anything, you know you're gonna get *****.
    • Waterrat, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1 Either way,we pay the price, always have,always will...Sometimes,as with technology,we get to pay twice,once for the original funding,and again when we purchase the new gizmo's in the store.
  • smotpoker1, on 10/03/2008, -2/+20***** those fat cats put them in prison for fraud.
  • GreasyLou, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3Do not think that the Harvard graduates in Wall Street have any common sense. They are as dumb as any ignoramus this a basic question of risk and risk has to be diversified, if not the risk become so high that there is a guarantee of loss. Why should they care they have already have the money.
  • Bloodwine, on 10/03/2008, -2/+17This whole "Main Street everyday joe average regular folk is against the bailout due to anger at Wall Street elites" sentiment is incorrect. It's downright condescending, to be brutally honest.

    Sure us Main Street folks aren't econ wizards, but at the same time it appears that few on Wall Street or in the banking industry even understand the monster that they created. When the whole system is based on smoke, mirrors, and voodoo magic, it might be time to try and peel back the insanity and try and plot a road back to something more reasonable and normal.

    I think many of us on Main Street are looking at the bailout and saying, "This is a horrible idea. It won't address the real issues and at best it may just buy us some more time". Heck, even several politicians are saying it probably won't fix anything, but it'll provide confidence. I'm sorry, but throwing $700b (over $800b if you look at the package as a whole) at a "feel good, get some confidence" gesture is downright stupid. Meanwhile, we'll all end up even poorer due to the increased inflation that it will bring.

    Lastly, I'm getting tired of being bombarded with fear tactics and threats. I feel like Uncle Sam's abused spouse.
    • Crimsoneer, on 10/03/2008, -1/+2Our entire market is based on confidence. Boosting confidence is precisely what has to be done.
      • rotundo, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3No -- confidence based on hand-waving and smoke and mirrors is only going to cause another downfall. That's what got us where we are now.

        The confidence has to come from something real -- something like measurable American productivity gains. If it comes from dumping borrowed money into the system it's just going to keep us from addressing the real issue: our market is overvalued (due to the type of artificial "confidence" you suggest) and it has to come down.

  • Nintendesert, on 10/03/2008, -2/+12Just give the 700 Billion back to us and we'll use it to weather any storm.
    • BigW, on 10/03/2008, -0/+6Exactly!! This bailout amounts to over TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS for every man, woman and child in the US. The size of this thing is STAGGERING.

      It is ironic (infuriating?) that the size of this bailout for Wall Street is orders of magnitude larger than the "Economic Stimulus" that everyone got.....
  • F9Phoenix, on 10/03/2008, -10/+4MrBabySpam
  • narcofiche, on 10/03/2008, -1/+21You know how to get revenge? Everybody stop living in their world. Stop living beyond your means, stop filling your credit cards with ***** you don't need, buy locally as much as possible, stop buying into this idea that the two major political parties in America are actually different and stop blindly listening to talking heads on TV and start thinking for yourself.

    If enough people stop supporting these rich assholes, they will have no power or control over us.
    • rotundo, on 10/03/2008, -0/+9This is exactly it. People, and the nation, love what you can do with credit. But this is the result of credit: you overextend yourself and when things don't go as planned, you're *****. Credit is just a way to steal money from your future self... whether for people or for nations.

      Sure, there are a handful of good things that credit can allow us to do if used prudently. But it seems that just about nobody has the self discipline to use it prudently.

      Get off credit. If you can't afford it now, wait until you can.
      • shikamoo, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3Seriously, when we're talking about accountability, it starts at home and the so-called "predatory lending" wouldn't even exist if people had their heads on straight.
      • serif69, on 10/03/2008, -1/+2The issue with getting off credit is that almost every single business in America works on credit. When credit dries up, so too does business. If my business didn't offer credit to our clients, we would never have work. We extend credit to them by giving them a certain amount of time to pay invoices, we get work, and we get paid. In the meantime, we have a line of credit from a bank from which to draw if our actual revenue falls short of our accounts receivable, which is frequently, in order to pay our own expenses. This is how almost every single B-to-B company works, regardless of industry, product, or service. If the banks stop giving credit to us, the we stop giving credit to customers and clients, and trade slows to a crawl.
  • Shakermaker, on 10/03/2008, -3/+11Gimme a break. Like the American people are going to do anything.

    What the US needs is a second American Revolution to take the country back from professional politicians, who are only in it for the money. All that is going to happen, is a lot of biatching and moaning....and then back to your TV's and Playstation's.

    Nothing is going to happen, and nothing will ever happen - the American people will sleep right through it.
    • dondara, on 10/03/2008, -0/+6A horrible, pessimistic outlook that is most likely correct.
    • bloodomen13, on 10/03/2008, -0/+7We'll be asleep in our lazyboys when they come to slit our throats.

      The problem is that as a people we are too distant from one another. We do not have communities. Hell, most of us don't even know the name of our neighbors... how can we organize?

      It isn't important until it happens to us directly and by then it's too late. People are so content with watching things happen on TV while saying "how terrible it is" but not actually acting.
      • Waterrat, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1 And those in power like it that way..Then they don't have to deal with us.
  • monkeyrun, on 10/03/2008, -2/+3No, actually it's just capitalism.

    Is it me or is Econ 101 not part of the core college classes?

    Well the bill passed anyway, why bother.
  • WriterinSac, on 10/03/2008, -2/+11In 1789 France, when supposedly Marie Antionette said "let them eat cake" when people were starving, they had a little thing called a revolution. Like the philosopher George Santayana said "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

    What's it going to take for America to wake up and take back its country?
    • Hetman, on 10/03/2008, -1/+7You forgot to mention that the french revolution caused hundreds of thousands of deaths. And it was only when a dictator Napolean siezed power that the country stabilized. I am just saying revolutions are very destructive and we should try to do everything possible to fix the government before we turn to such extreme measures.
      • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Debating - Check.
        Protests - Check
        Voting - Check

        Am I missing something? What else would you have the people do? Yes people will die - but aren't people already dying? People will lose everything - but aren't people already losing everything?

        Yes it is going to suck if a revolution happens - but the reality sadly is that a fight has been brewing for a number of years now - this is another hit to the taxpayers, in a long list of hits. Nothing is changing, and a lot of people don't believe anything is going to change.

        There is going to be a fight - whether now or the future, and it is going to be about the underlying cause on this crisis. So the real question is who do you want to fight it? You or your children?
      • Hetman, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2Most revolutions like the French Revolution is caused when people are starving on the streets. It has not gotten that bad yet. Usually as long as people are not starving to death revolution do not come to fruition. Anyways I really do not care because I am not having kids. And peace like happiness is enternal not external. So yes I can survive and be happy and have peace with in myself with out violence.
  • skinturtle, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3Unbelievable! Just because the public doesn't want to foot the bill run up by rich men who should be the ones paying for their own greed...these foolish articles appear trying to convince us our reaction is just psychological instinct for revenge.

    No that's right...our concern over this has nothing to do with common sense or justice...we're just mindless animals wanting revenge!

    Why not do a an article about why wall street is so instinctively greedy?
    • LilRabbitFooFoo, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Because the media companies are now owned by the same five uber Fat Cats...
  • oldhick, on 10/03/2008, -0/+5Once again the elites, those who are in power, and those who will profit tell us how we can't comprehend the problem. We're too ignorant to understand CDO's, monetary policy, regulations, and credit availability. They laugh at us common folk. And maybe rightfully so.
    What have we done to make them stop laughing? When have we taken our destinies into our own hands? When have we stood up to the politicians in both parties? When have we stood up to the CEO's and wall street?
    • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1Indeed. Until the people make their feudal lords, take notice, the lord will continue their ways.
  • shikamoo, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2Where's the sense of balance in the outrage? For every politician who had a misguided sense that people had a RIGHT to own homes they couldn't afford, for every lender who was unscrupulous in giving out loans to people who couldn't afford them, there were thousands and thousands of idiots who signed on the dotted line on mortgages they were incapable of living up to.
    • elementop, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2If *only* the politicians, unscrupulous lenders and idiots who wanted more than they could afford would be affected by this, I would agree. But what happens when the effects of the economic collapse trickle down to everyone else?

      I can't speak for everyone here, but I *have* been living within my means for about a decade now. Nevertheless, I am still concerned about whether or not I'll have a job in a year.
    • Waiting2awake, on 10/03/2008, -0/+2STOP IT ! ! ! Stop letting them frame the arguement. This isn't about bad loans. The bad loans, and the C credit paper they started aren't an issue. Yes, everyone defaulting would have bad consequences, but those would have been local to the US.

      The problem is - are you listening to me - is that those bankers and investors took that c paper and lied, and manipulated the rules, with the help of the government of course, to be able to sell that C credit paper as A credit paper thus getting a HUGE HUGE HUGE profit from it. They sold these CDO/S around the globe.

      The issue isn't the poor people that signed loans that they couldn't deal with, that would be an easy deal to fix. The problem is "the smartest men in the room" were given carte blanche again, and again, they showed that not only would they sell their mothers, they'd send them C.O.D. The solution, as they tell it, is to give them carte blanche again....

      What you are seeing is that people - disagree with their solution.
  • benji1974, on 10/03/2008, -0/+9We don't own a home and never will... not financially viable for us. We will never own a new car or one that we have to get a loan for. We have no credit to worry about. We own everything outright that we buy. My wife works at Wal-Mart and we make ends meet and though the market has been hit hard the commodities markets have remained strong because it supplies the peoples needs instead of the wants. We are poor (wife makes less than 20k a year and I am fighting for disability) and we live fine without needing credit and we don't do without either because we budget and live within our means, hell we even grow some of our own food, it's really not that hard and doesn't take much space.

    I don't suggest that this is how everyone should live but I am saying it's possible and not that difficult to do.

    How exactly is this Wall street crisis going to effect my families Main street life style? I just don't see it and I don't see any reason to help the ones that are crying wolf either as middle class that drive the credit market or the fat cats that worked smoke and mirrors to fool those in the middle class. I think everyone needs to learn a lesson and deserves a little spanking on this.

    To hell with the bail out and let the middle class have their retribution. A little chaos is a good thing now and again. It stirs the senses and makes you know that you are alive.
    • Acqua206, on 10/04/2008, -1/+1Does your wife really work at Walmart? Do you live near casinos? I part timed as a table games dealer in college and pulled in an average of $100 a night plus $60 in wages. On a good day, I would get $200-$500 in tips. As long as you don't get into gambling, its a lucrative job that doesn't require much education. Most dealer schools run around $1200 and help you land auditions and jobs.
      I know its unsolicited advice but I feel bad making more than someones full time job when I was just part timing for sneaker money.
      • benji1974, on 10/04/2008, -0/+1It's not a matter of how much money we make... the point is we have what we need and don't need more than what we have... We don't care about easy money... hell I would be happy if there was no need for money at all. Casino work isn't the answer for making money either for one we don't live near a casino and for two I don't believe in them. We don't support state lotteries or church bingos either they are a wasteful symptom of our societies excesses.

        As you get older you realize that money isn't as important as long as you family is taken care of first and you can give them a good set of values to raise your children by and placing such a high priority on financial gains and monetary possessions in life is what has gotten us as a society where we are right now.

        So in honesty what could your dealer job for sneaker money do for us as a family that would be better than what we do for ourselves now except give us an inflated sense of value that doesn't really mean anything in the greater scope of things.

        Can you explain to me where the fault is of making an honest living working at Wal-Mart is a bad thing? It supports our family and we are fine because of it. Please don't look down on my family with pity because we don't make the amount of money you approve of it does not make you a better person than us and until you got to understand our values I would suggest you really look at what's important in your life and get back to me.
  • radicalchaos, on 10/03/2008, -1/+3Get the rope. It's time to start hanging some people. We'll start with Bush and Cheney and go from there.
  • jsffive, on 10/03/2008, -0/+3Look. I understand that we have a system now that REQUIRES government intervention now and again. But I don't think it's fair that I, a person who has NO house or car loans, have to help pay for these poor investments.

    Now, if the government buys up these loans, and then changes the payment schedules so the PEOPLE can keep their houses, then I don't mind biting the bullet. But if the government is going to use this as a land grab, then they can kiss my ass.

    Regardless of the outcome, I want the reasons for this bubble to be addressed, and eradicated, so we don't have to come back in another twenty years, and do it over again.
  • edpapavitch, on 10/03/2008, -0/+1if the little worker ant wants to oust the queen, the whole colony will collapse. not sure if thats such a good idea. if the worker ant wasn't reliant on the colony, it wouldn't that as big of a problem. but its still not an easy task to accomplish for most.
  • BillE3, on 10/04/2008, -0/+1They provide a service, but no, they do not produce any goods.
  •  

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