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Microsoft Goes Open Source! Well At Least for One Project
news.cnet.com — InfoWorld was the first to report that Microsoft has released a new Touchless SDK to help developers kick the tires on multi-touch technology. But it was TechCrunch that pointed to perhaps a more significant aspect of the release: it's open source
bianconeri4ever- 650 diggs
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- Phoenixheart, on 10/11/2008, -14/+17Incorrect title. Microsoft has gone open source at least once with its .NET framework. Well, kind of.
- TedTschopp, on 10/12/2008, -12/+8There is a bunch of Microsoft Open Source code in Google's Chrome.
- alanr19, on 10/12/2008, -2/+9Really? Got any links to any of them.
Microsoft publishes its open source code (or its bastardized version of OSS) in codeplex, not google's code site.
Just because chrome compiles for windows and uses WTL doesn't mean it's microsoft's code (even the illegally reverse engineered code in chrome. google that.). - violentvinyl, on 10/12/2008, -6/+2Since when is it illegal to reverse engineer something? Knowing how your software works falls under fair use, it's what keeps developers honest.
- TedTschopp, on 10/12/2008, -2/+3A couple of questions.
1. Is WTL open source?
2. Is WTL in Chrome?
3. Did Microsoft, or someone employeed by Microsoft, write WTL? - alanr19, on 10/12/2008, -2/+7@violentvinyl
When you agree to the Windows EULA that prohibits reverse engineering, then breaking that EULA is illegal.
That's when. - loconet, on 10/12/2008, -0/+4@alanr19
TedTschopp is correct. WTL is under Ms-PL (OSI approved). WTL is used in Chrome* and yes, WTL was written by MS. So yes, There is MS code in Chrome (Chromium to be precise) that is "Open Source".
* http://src.chromium.org/viewvc/chrome/trunk/src/ch ... - andycr512, on 10/12/2008, -0/+5"breaking that EULA is illegal.
That's when."
Debatable. To my knowledge EULA's haven't been tested in court, and the law contradicts the Microsoft EULA in many ways. - violentvinyl, on 10/13/2008, -1/+3@ alanr19
Fair use trumps EULA's in the US. Just because I write something down on paper and make you agree to it, it doesn't make it legally binding. That's the cornerstone of our legal system.
- alanr19, on 10/12/2008, -2/+9Really? Got any links to any of them.
- loconet, on 10/12/2008, -2/+21.NET Open Source? Really? In what respect?
- kyanit3, on 10/12/2008, -1/+2Charlie?
- CVL4317, on 10/12/2008, -6/+1I can see Microsoft from my screen. I know Microsoft's policy.
- HonoredMule, on 10/12/2008, -0/+6Open Spec != Open Source
Open Standard (excluding OOXML) > Open Source > Open Spec - KAMiKAZOW, on 10/13/2008, -2/+1Microsoft's Rotor project. I think it's not maintained any more, but at least .NET 1.X had a "shared source" release for FreeBSD and Mac OS X.
PS: "Open source" (as in: source code is available) is not the same as Free Software. - loconet, on 10/13/2008, -0/+5As far as the OSI definition of Open source is concern, "Open Source" means more than just the source code being available. That version of the CLI (Rotor) was equivalent to having the source code under a glass display with a big "do not touch, do not copy - just look sign". It was only useful for non-commercial use (eg. academia). There used to be ways to access the Windows source code under similar arrangements, yet you don't see people calling it Open Source.
So yes, .NET Open Source? Really?
- alanr19, on 10/12/2008, -1/+33The .Net Frmaework is NOT open source, not even "kind of", the source code is available to view when debugging in the IDE.
You can not download/fork it/rename it etc. Just because the source is viewable does not make it open source. FFS
Microsoft WIX was however the first proper open source project released by Microsoft.
http://port25.technet.com/archive/2006/04/25/WIX_3 ...- tracker1, on 10/12/2008, -0/+10They've released quite a few projects under MS-PL licensing, which is about as good as BDS + Mutually assured destruction clause. Most of the ones I have seen relate to various .Net addons/extensions though... it is worth looking at.
- TedTschopp, on 10/12/2008, -12/+8There is a bunch of Microsoft Open Source code in Google's Chrome.
- Filter, on 10/11/2008, -5/+19They have other open source projects. They have contributed some to the open source community. I would like to see them contribute more to the open source community but I doubt it will ever happen.
- daeken, on 10/12/2008, -1/+6They've been contributing a /lot/ lately. The DLR, IronPython, IronRuby, WiX, and others have been released under OSI-approved licenses. Now if they'd release F# and other such projects under non-tainting licenses...
- plimpton, on 10/13/2008, -1/+0You mean like the recent submission to the PHP project ADOdb (BSD license)? Seriously, pay attention to the news
- Spr0k3t, on 10/11/2008, -8/+55The microsoft version of open source: "Here's our code, now improve upon it, just don't let any other operating system use it or they shall face our veiled threats of the patent monster."
- kettlechips, on 10/11/2008, -2/+16The license this was released did not have the Windows-only clause.
- ogarro, on 10/12/2008, -6/+3But it does have a glaring patent loop hole as well as none re-licensing lock in.
- santasing, on 10/12/2008, -8/+19Exactly, MS is trying to dilute the Open Source brand with its "shared source" crap.
- mizike, on 10/12/2008, -10/+1LOL!
- daeken, on 10/12/2008, -2/+5Except that they're releasing most of their open source code under MSPL, which is OSI-approved. The DLR, IronPython, etc are released under this language.
- melonhedd, on 10/12/2008, -3/+6Open source is not a brand.
- santasing, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1Open Source is not a brand, its a legal entity. But to managers and the general public, it is a brand.
OSI-approved means nothing. OSI approves so many things. Dosen't mean it is Open Source.
- mahadiga, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1Open source != GPL
- kettlechips, on 10/11/2008, -2/+16The license this was released did not have the Windows-only clause.
- ButterLoyalist, on 10/11/2008, -24/+4Good work, Micro$oft.
- betrayed, on 10/12/2008, -4/+25that $ is really getting old
really.- ufia, on 10/12/2008, -4/+28Yeah $ is close to worthless now.
Should go with Micro€oft. - gn0stik, on 10/13/2008, -1/+1Euro is losing ground against the dollar in a pretty big way lately ufia. It's still worth more, but just. It's not like it used to be. It's lost over 20 cents in recent months, as has the pound, and the CAD is getting it's ass whomped. Not that the dollar is going to be worth more, but you over estimate the problems with US Currency. It's been gaining against other currencies in spite of the bank problems. The media has been pretty quiet on europe's economic woes in comparison the US's. It's only 1.3 to 1 now as opposed to 1.6 to one, not so long ago. CAD was worth more against the USD than that not too long ago.
- ufia, on 10/12/2008, -4/+28Yeah $ is close to worthless now.
- andregriffin, on 10/12/2008, -5/+8Ohh! I see, you replaced the "s" with a dollar sign to imply that they are rich and greedy. Wow, that is just so fresh. So original. Did you come up with that?
It's much more original than reusing material you see on TV, say, Family Guy for instance.- LeviTheSmith, on 10/12/2008, -3/+1Kinda like that time..
- betrayed, on 10/12/2008, -4/+25that $ is really getting old
- kangy3213, on 10/12/2008, -7/+13yeah, ***** potatoes!
oh wait - adog317, on 10/12/2008, -16/+5how dare they soil the name of open source
- rieuwa, on 10/12/2008, -8/+36Actually... if people spent time looking around Microsoft's CodePlex, they would find a great variety of Open Source projects....
And in terms of contribution and collaboration with the OS community you might be surprised the things you see/hear on MS Campus...- santasing, on 10/12/2008, -17/+3Let's have a link then.
I didn't thibk so.- LeviTheSmith, on 10/12/2008, -2/+8http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q=Microsofts ...
First result on Google.
- LeviTheSmith, on 10/12/2008, -2/+8http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q=Microsofts ...
- santasing, on 10/13/2008, -0/+2Great, MS CodePlex. If you must know, MS's definition of Open Source is "Shared source".
Sometime, you do have to do a little research. - plimpton, on 10/13/2008, -1/+0http://port25.technet.com/archive/2008/07/25/oscon ...
- santasing, on 10/12/2008, -17/+3Let's have a link then.
- scy1192, on 10/12/2008, -1/+55Why is this in the Linux/Unix section?
- ZippyV, on 10/12/2008, -10/+3Because it's anti-Microsoft.
- hugolp, on 10/12/2008, -1/+10How is this anti-Microsoft?
- ZippyV, on 10/12/2008, -1/+3Judging by the title from the submitter.
- werries, on 10/12/2008, -0/+23We have a whole damn microsoft section, put it there.
- Nath2k8, on 10/12/2008, -1/+3To attract more attention?
- ZippyV, on 10/12/2008, -10/+3Because it's anti-Microsoft.
- venom8599, on 10/12/2008, -3/+9Isn't GPL compatible, because of: 3. (B) If you bring a patent claim against any contributor over patents that you claim are infringed by the software, your patent license from such contributor to the software ends automatically.
Still it's nice to see some opening up.- tracker1, on 10/12/2008, -1/+3How is the mutually assured destruction clause specifically incompatible with GPL? Without that clause, it's pretty similar to a BSD license.
- venom8599, on 10/12/2008, -0/+6Sorry, my mistake. It isn't incompatible with every version of the GPL. It's incompatible with GPLv2, and compatible with GPLv3.
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/license-list.html#So ...
- venom8599, on 10/12/2008, -0/+6Sorry, my mistake. It isn't incompatible with every version of the GPL. It's incompatible with GPLv2, and compatible with GPLv3.
- tracker1, on 10/12/2008, -1/+3How is the mutually assured destruction clause specifically incompatible with GPL? Without that clause, it's pretty similar to a BSD license.
- nixarn, on 10/12/2008, -4/+6this is just crap. It's not like microsoft has released something like this before. It's just a little tech demo by some student.
- Ev3nt372, on 10/12/2008, -8/+16In comparison to Apple who patented multi-touch gestures so their competition cant use a multi-touch interface that is intuitive to control.
- jbeams, on 10/12/2008, -4/+14Open Source is not Free Software. In addition, it's absurd to describe a set of libraries built for accessing closed/proprietary services as a step forward.
- Buckwyld, on 10/12/2008, -8/+3I am excited for multitouch. I truly believe it will be the next big step with computers.
- 4321234, on 10/12/2008, -7/+23Microsoft. Microsoft. They always make some little gesture to appear less evil just before they're ready to slaughter and eat a fresh crop of babies.
- MrOss, on 10/12/2008, -6/+3This is only a move to create hype and popularity not a genuine move toward anything open source. The hype is working, look, it's on digg's homepage.
- Z_Man, on 10/12/2008, -1/+7This isn't the first time.
- digitallysick, on 10/12/2008, -0/+4So this could be ported to linux/unix then?
- sirhomer, on 10/12/2008, -0/+2Sure, on the Mono platform. I am sure someone will be watching this carefully to see if it is worth porting over to Linux. But keep in mind there are already libraries (OpenCV for example) available on Linux that can do the exact same thing but also can do a lot more. OpenCV is most commonly used for this type of thing especially in academia. So the usefulness of the library may not be evident (yet).
- SitPoMk, on 10/12/2008, -6/+9What bugs me is it seems that Microsoft doesn't innovate anymore. It sees what is the new trend and comes up for its own forgettable name for it. Think of Silverlight, Live Search and MSN Ads, Zune, Expression Studio ... now this (I'm sure i'm missing some). All of these concepts were introduced by someone else.
I'm not trying to bash Microsoft here as they have most likely done more for me than any other company. I am just a little disappointed at how the company who created Windows, arguably one of the most important creations of our time, has gone down such a low level of playing catchup with the trends rather than leading the industry with innovation.- iofthestorm, on 10/12/2008, -4/+8Office 2007/2008 for Mac? That's pretty innovative. And actually, I'd say Microsoft's quality has gone up in recent years, despite what people say about Vista. The only real problem with Vista is that it uses more resources than XP, but of course XP used more than 98 which used more than 95 etc... And I think they're doing pretty well with the 360, even though I wouldn't buy one simply because I prefer PC gaming.
- SitPoMk, on 10/12/2008, -1/+5Yea you're right when it comes to gaming, Microsoft comes out on top. I might be dugg down by Nintendo fans but we've got to face we don't live in a Mario world anymore.
Along with Windows and programming solutions like Visual Studio and such, Office is up there with greatest achievements of Microsoft but it's been around for a while. While it is good that it is available for mac, I wouldn't go as far as calling it an innovation.
- SitPoMk, on 10/12/2008, -1/+5Yea you're right when it comes to gaming, Microsoft comes out on top. I might be dugg down by Nintendo fans but we've got to face we don't live in a Mario world anymore.
- iofthestorm, on 10/12/2008, -4/+8Office 2007/2008 for Mac? That's pretty innovative. And actually, I'd say Microsoft's quality has gone up in recent years, despite what people say about Vista. The only real problem with Vista is that it uses more resources than XP, but of course XP used more than 98 which used more than 95 etc... And I think they're doing pretty well with the 360, even though I wouldn't buy one simply because I prefer PC gaming.
- Joh739, on 10/12/2008, -4/+4Hmm, I'm not convinced... Sorry MS!
- ahmedinejad, on 10/12/2008, -7/+2my dick is sour :/
- oblique63, on 10/12/2008, -0/+1put some splenda on it...
- StripeyMagee, on 10/12/2008, -4/+2About as close as MS will ever come to open source would be a game like Spore.
- daeken, on 10/12/2008, -3/+5Yes, because IronPython, IronRuby, the DLR, WiX, etc aren't released under OSI-approved licenses and Microsoft doesn't run an open-source project hosting site. Oh, wait...
- bduddy, on 10/12/2008, -2/+1Allegiance, anyone?
- superlou, on 10/12/2008, -0/+0Agreed. Just wish I had a joystick.
- fatas, on 10/12/2008, -2/+1but there is always a touch I mean a catch
- colincornaby, on 10/12/2008, -0/+7The article is incorrect. Touchless is not multitouch software (maybe the name should have been a hint to the author?) It's software that reads input from a camera, much like EyeToy.
- ArthurSucks, on 10/12/2008, -0/+4Wasn't there an open source MSI instillation builder that Microsoft released? I'm sure Microsoft will embrace the open source model once they find out how profitable it can be.
- daeken, on 10/12/2008, -0/+3Yes, WiX. The DLR and many other pieces of software have also been released under OSI-approved licenses.
- daeken, on 10/12/2008, -0/+3Yes, WiX. The DLR and many other pieces of software have also been released under OSI-approved licenses.
- JoelJ, on 10/12/2008, -0/+1Singularity - Open Source kernel made my MS.
- gilbes, on 10/12/2008, -2/+2No wonder people fear/hate Microsoft. They know very little about it and think it is the same company of 10 years ago. In technology terms, that is anchient.
MS has many open source projects.
MS also has made the source code availble for many products including the libraries for the .Net framework. They are not open source though. However, the .Net framework in incorporating opens source components like the Dynamic Language Runtime.
The .Net CRL and C# are published standards with ISO and EMCA.
They also have a bunch of open source research projects like Singualrity.
"Well At Least for One Project" Yeah, you keep thinking that buddy. It's trash like this that keeps the tech community at large most ignorant to the truth about software. - iiiears, on 10/12/2008, -0/+1One step closer to market and daily use. Congratulations Microsoft.
- MMaster23, on 10/12/2008, -0/+4Incorrect .. Microsoft has been pumping out open-source projects for years now.
Go ahead .. digg me down.. won't change the truth tough. - DreadKnight, on 10/12/2008, -1/+1I should have buried this not digg it... :-(
- ultrafez, on 10/12/2008, -0/+4Go into your profile, then you can undigg the story under the "dugg stories" section. Then you can bury it.
- DreadKnight, on 10/28/2008, -0/+1Oh thanks :D
- ultrafez, on 10/12/2008, -0/+4Go into your profile, then you can undigg the story under the "dugg stories" section. Then you can bury it.
- FKnight, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1Buried. Second part of submission title is a lie.
- DestroyFascism, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1Sif!
- DestroyFascism, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1sif
- AlaskaLoneWolf, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1...amazes me how some things change. Perhaps they finally see the writing on the wall, and will quit trying to patent programming routines like bubble-sort, etc... so we can get some new software without a huge monopoly crying 'foul' with lawsuits.
- Feldon, on 10/13/2008, -0/+1Sniff Sniff i smell something funny,
- sdmahesh06, on 10/13/2008, -0/+2MySQL is open source
- garrett2399, on 10/13/2008, -0/+0I don't believe that Microsoft will ever do anything that is not profit driven. If they are utilizing open source then it is to drive up revenue for closed source applications.
- plimpton, on 10/13/2008, -0/+0Yeah, just like IBM, Sun...etc
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