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- spydon, on 03/11/2008, -2/+18You will never win against the torrenthydra thats a fact!
- ThePirateParty, on 03/11/2008, -1/+9Bastards!
- sporg, on 03/11/2008, -1/+1Arrrrrrrhhhhhh!
- friend18, on 03/11/2008, -0/+31Next they are going to go after Dell for "facilitating in copyright infringement".
- rivalius13, on 03/11/2008, -0/+20All that hard drive space, OF COURSE they're going to use it for illegal downloads!!
- falafelkiosken, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1That leads to the next step; WD
- edd17, on 03/11/2008, -0/+22Or go after the artists, they are the ones ultimately responsible for piracy.
- dsmx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+1How about the plastic manufacturers there supporting the pirates by helping in the construction of the servers and the users machines.
- frsrblch, on 03/11/2008, -0/+6They should cut to the chase and go after content producers for "facilitating in copyright infringement". No content, no infringement - it's right in line with their current mindset.
- rivalius13, on 03/11/2008, -0/+20All that hard drive space, OF COURSE they're going to use it for illegal downloads!!
- rivalius13, on 03/11/2008, -1/+6I knew it was a good idea to go with BT.
- StephenCIreland, on 03/11/2008, -0/+5Hi 5 on that, its simple , eircom blocks torrents/ p2p -> people will move to encrypted software or one of the 30-40 broadbad providers in ireland :P, torrent sites could start vpn connections with encryption
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+10Telling an ISP to block P2P is ISP-suicide!
“Illegal P2P file-sharing may have helped drive broadband subscriptions in the past, yet today these activities, particularly in respect of movies, are hogging bandwidth,”
If IFPI think that telling ISP to block P2P or any other "bandwidth hogging" activities is in the best interest of the ISP then they should give them the money lost from each customer who leaves that ISP (obviously requiring a services that lets them download).
It sounds like the only legitimate use of the internet is downloading- matx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+21k html files
>_< digg broke my comment. - frazw, on 03/11/2008, -0/+4They aren't necessarily trying to block piracy on this ISP's network although that will be one of the outcomes.
What they are actually trying to do is set precedent in a smaller country so that they can push this through globally.
This is the first snowflake of their intended avalanche.- matx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+6Yeah, but the ISP will quickly go out of business if they adopt this unless they are really stupid. ISP's are only interested in money, not stopping piracy.
- frazw, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1Well the first adopters would, if the law forces them too. At some point there would be so many forced to do it that the option to move would start to become difficult. But only if this initial attack works.
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+6Yeah, but the ISP will quickly go out of business if they adopt this unless they are really stupid. ISP's are only interested in money, not stopping piracy.
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+21k html files
- yunus, on 03/11/2008, -0/+38If this wins let the flood gates open. Email scams are now the fault of the ISP as well as pornography that shouldn't be seen by people and if the terrorists use the Internet well that's the ISP's fault as well. Lets not stop there though, any phone scams, yeah that's the fault of the Telecom companies. Mail fraud, well that's the mail carriers responsibility too. Ridiculous!
- stonedparadox, on 03/11/2008, -3/+4im very curious as to how this turns out im from ireland and im with Eircom .. have been for years
i havent Read the story but i heard it on the news and here .. but i hope eircom dont listen or make some sort of deal or basically what matX said
:(
is BT any good? - oldexplorer, on 03/11/2008, -1/+19Looks like I'll have to reactivate my SSH tunneling account. Secure downloading through the cloud is the only way we're going to defeat these music/movie corporations. Secure torrenting will soon be available - lots of people are working on that right now. These corporations will never win, ever.
- fkr3, on 03/11/2008, -5/+2Defeat them? You have to actually be fighting something to defeat something. You're not fighting them when you load up your iPod with all the music and movies you want but couldn't be arsed paying for.
- igyigyigy, on 03/11/2008, -0/+21***** the IFPI!
- eroticpie, on 03/11/2008, -0/+11for every P2P program they block the only result will be a more efficient and secure P2P client will be released to take it's place
file sharing is not going away, they need to give up and embrace a new business model that takes advantage of it - tweak33, on 03/11/2008, -0/+4I recently switched from esat to eircom and I for one am pissed off....this action is ridiculous and if it comes before the courts should immediately be thrown out. Any Irish users of DIGG should be down to their local representative and make it known that laws on this issue should be made, and not to protect the music/film industry but to ensure that no ridiculous action like this should be taken again....
- jdepp, on 03/11/2008, -0/+3Oh dear. I hope the IFPI loses this one, it risks dooming teh internets by making ISPs install crappy, expensive-to-implement, easy-to-work-round half-baked monitoring techniques.
If the IFPI is forced to bear the financial cost of implementing the monitoring system, that could be fair. I wouldn't mind seeing them go ***** up but I'd like an ISP that offered an affordable service. I hope the judges don't cure the disease by killing the patient. - w1ndow, on 03/11/2008, -0/+4i am with ntl/upc in ireland and it pointless to downloads torrents with the packet shaping :(
- theculchie1, on 03/11/2008, -0/+2Encrypt your torrents! Their packet shaping software is really poor and can't detect encrypted BT comms.
- cidman2001, on 03/11/2008, -0/+3I think the "making available for infringement" argument is a dangerous precedent for the labels. Don't they make it available for infringement when they release it in a digital format. It would only take a savy lawyer and an angry artist to start a huge class action against these jokers. File sharing was never an issue with vinyl...
- coyote1284, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1How many people did they bust for making mix tapes, especially those recorded from radio?
- smotpoker1, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1wouldn't it make the riaa and music label liable for all the gansta rap?all the crimes committed while listening to music?
- irishpal25, on 03/11/2008, -2/+0thank ***** im not with ***** eircom. go smart telecom lol
- Myztry, on 03/11/2008, -1/+3They are fighting a battle they can't win. Foolish foolish simpletons. They need to provide a service better than than the legally dogged pirate provider. They need to start leveraging the networks. Torrents are ideal with a slightly modified server/client.
Torrent trackers are a point of control. A good balance could be reached quite simply. Provide non-DRM'd titles with fixed length unique encrypted 'owner' tag. Display the tag in players (name and shame). Seed the networks with "Stolen from:" tags. These will have the most sources quite soon, and be the chosen torrent.
Allow those who will risk it to obtain free music (as they do now). BUT use the tracker to give upload credits for feeding the network. Allow both the purchasers and the 50?:1 seeders to be granted ownership. Download speeds would be amazing, illegal songs would be identifiable (to nab commercial offenders, as it will never be feasible to persecute the masses), distribution costs would all but cease, and those carrying the network will get paid as such.
[OEM public key][Encrypted Owner Tag][Raw distributable content] - Maybe MP3 tags could be used?
They need to start considering such half-way points for they are simply pissing in the wind as it now stands.- boobsbr, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1kind of a good idea, but i think people still don't like any kind of identification in the internet, even owner tags.
- Myztry, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1Then we should keep things as they are? That's not really working is it.
Their are certainly worse things than having your own name (real or user) on something you own, It could allow people unlimited device transfers, legal protection, legacy compatibility (mp3tag?), and lightning downloads. Not a bad trade off.
For people who refuse to pay, they still get semi-legit access, ability to earn ownership, access to reliable legitimate user seeds, are able to contribute to commercial distribution.
The "stolen from:" tag would be a deterrent (except to rebels) but puts them at no more risk than they are already exposed to, while adding a peer pressure element. The tags could be simply removed, but to do so would be inconvenient. The major audio tools would not allow it. Adding a fake tag would be near impossible without an OEM private key.
Oh, and the torrent client would never seed the owner tag, to prevent username/IP address tying. No other real caveats I can think of while chewing mental gum. - boobsbr, on 03/15/2008, -0/+1Well, someone will find a way to remove the tags, adding OEM key will only make it take longer, remember the DVDJon and DeCSS, and HDDVD key revolt on Digg? Since torrent protocol is open, someone will make a torrent client that will read the tags anyways. There is no way to control this situation. Why not let people own they music for which they pay, without digital watermarks and fingerprints, tags, free from a specific format? Were you a customer of AllOfMp3? It was a great site, you could buy music without the fear of being traced, in various formats, for an affordable price. The problem is that the RIAA said it was not getting the money from the sales, and neither were the artists. So instead of trying to solve the problem by talking and passing the money around they put pressure on Russia to shut the site down, they were giving to much freedom to the customer.
It's a matter of freedom, surveillance, restriction AND price. Remember QTrax? Well, they monitor your music habits with their software.
- Myztry, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1Then we should keep things as they are? That's not really working is it.
- boobsbr, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1kind of a good idea, but i think people still don't like any kind of identification in the internet, even owner tags.
- computershack, on 03/11/2008, -6/+0Sadly, the bandwidth hogging argument is actually a very valid one and one that many ISPs are going to listen to/use as an excuse because it's what is hitting the bottom line. ISPs are having to buy more and more bandwidth to provide a usable level of service whilst not being able to increase monthly fees so it means their profit margin is far lower.
P2P/Bittorrent is mainly used for illegal filesharing despite protestations otherwise. Sure, the tech savvy would find an easy way around it but the majority of P2P/Bittorent users are hardly the most technically adept so such a ban would have the effect of wiping out the majority of users who are what I'd call casual piraters. The ISPs get to reduce their bandwidth bills. Users get to see speed increases. The serious filesharers find a way around it and continue. Everyone wins.- matx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+2If people are willing to pay for bandwidth, ISP will be willing to supply it!
- boobsbr, on 03/11/2008, -0/+2bandwidth hogging is not a valid argument. if you paid for a connection, the SIP must be able to provide it to you regardless of how other customers are using their bandwidth. unless you signed a contract saying otherwise, which is your fault.
- dvavasour, on 03/11/2008, -0/+7How is an ISP meant to differentiate illegal P2P traffic from legitimate? For IFPI to seek any sort of injunction which would result in and ISP being compelled to block legitimate P2P traffic would be unjust.
- h3lx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+1Agreed...
If you have a bridge and criminals are crossing the bridge daily to rob folks on the other side of the river, the folks getting robbed can't go to you and demand that you not let any criminals cross the bridge. It's up to the individual property owners to make their property secure... it's like suing the gun manufacturers for gun crime. That said, if you can identify illegal traffic by embedded digital markers provided by the property owners and they're willing to offer you a considerable amount* of money to offset the expense of monitoring for these markers and reporting on their activity (a near impossibility) then that'll be fine. But the property owners have been anything but proactive and the definition of "considerable amount" has more than doubled after this incident. ***** them.
- h3lx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+1Agreed...
- WoollyMittens, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1So in the end the customers can pay for the legal costs and their own prosecution as potential copyright criminals.
- mcse2k3, on 03/11/2008, -0/+3Good luck bitches!
- PurpleSfinx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+2They already slow P2P in Australia on wireless Internet. It's disgraceful and it should be illegal. They advertise such and such amount of internet for X dollars a month (which ALREADY has a download limit, like 2 gigs - I'm not kidding), and then in tiny tiny little letters you see somewhere that bittorrent and such go at 28k - half of dial up speed. Hopefully these bastards will be forced to let all information through. I hope these guys don't win - there are heaps of legitimate uses for P2P software:
Downloading freeware (e.g. Linux distros)
Downloading trailers
Downloading demos
Downloading patches and 'service packs'
Downloading educational material- peppersauce, on 03/12/2008, -0/+0Downloading free music, mixes, podcasts. There are stacks of free music labels out there and lots of payed for music sites offering promo's etc. Surely it's ok to redistribute much of this legitamately.
When my friends record their latest set or track I will always spread the word and make it available to other friends or anyone else who wants it.
- peppersauce, on 03/12/2008, -0/+0Downloading free music, mixes, podcasts. There are stacks of free music labels out there and lots of payed for music sites offering promo's etc. Surely it's ok to redistribute much of this legitamately.
- theculchie1, on 03/11/2008, -0/+6I don't think these retards have a case against eircom. My only fear is our glorious court system might produce another howler of a decision as they seem to be doing frequently of late.
- lolinyerface, on 03/11/2008, -0/+7No matter what, sneakernet will still exist.
- falafelkiosken, on 03/11/2008, -0/+6It's the last spasm of a dying organisation.
- MobiusDick, on 03/11/2008, -0/+4The problem with the IFPI argument about bandwidth hogging is that whilst ISPs profits may be going down through having to buy more bandwidth it is clearly still profitable to allow P2P or they would have taken steps to remove this sort of traffic themselves. If I had a choice between using an ISP that censors and one that does not I would choose the one that is free from censorship, and I don't use P2P. I would do this out of the principle that the Internet should be completely accessible to all, without censorship or fear of recrimination from ISPs forced to be gatekeepers.
Additionally I do not believe the IFPI has any desire to help ISPs raise their profitability- they would just as soon fill former P2P occupied bandwidth with legitimate downloads that pour unreasonable amounts of money into their coffers.
If the IFPI wants to control "illegal file sharing" then they must be forced to pursue those who actually do the sharing not those who facilitate it. It would be like taking British Telecom to court for allowing conversations concerning illegal activities to take place. Or Royal Mail for carrying letter bombs at one time or another. Totally ridiculous.- hotcod, on 03/11/2008, -2/+2Some one threw a CD at me ones cutting my eye... i'm going to sue the record company for making this disk available!
- nwaozuzu, on 03/11/2008, -0/+2I guess this means they would have to take all the other ISPs to court and the ISPs would end up loosing a lot of their customers.
- bigbadgoat, on 03/11/2008, -1/+3I switched ISPs when one instituted a bandwidth cap. Any ISP who tries to argue with me that P2P users are using too much of their bandwidth can ram that argument up their ass. I am paying for the right to use their bandwidth. That is what I am signing up for. It doesn't make any sense. These ISPs make continuous upgrades to make our connections faster and faster, offer us 24 hour/day internet service and then expect us not to use it?
Did I mention most of these companies who complain about P2P users costing them millions always tend to post record earnings year after year? For every P2P user there are 50 users that use their broadband connection for nothing more than email and instant messaging.
Reminds me of my university's residences. I had been living in one of these residences for a couple years, and had developed the reputation of being the houses "computer guy". If anyone wanted anything done with their machine, they came to me. So when everyone came back from the summer and suddenly there was wireless internet available, everyone wanted to be set up (It runs an secure WPA-Enterprise encryption that requires registration from a computer on campus using a barcode from the resident's student ID). So things were fine for the first day or two, but after 3 or 4 days, the network started dropping users and when users could connect, their speeds were slow as *****.
So after a couple weeks of this *****, people were pissed off to all hell, so, the IT guys responsible for setting up and maintaining the network held a meeting with all of the "computer guys" from each of the 10 residences to discuss the issues with the system and how to fix it. The long and short of it? They network they set up couldn't handle the amount of registered users. They expected less than 20% of residents to be using the network, when the actual number was closer to 50-60%. So, when the access point exceeded the amount of users it could handle, it started dropping people to accommodate the new user. When the dropped user tried to re-connect, the access point would drop another, and so on.
This could be understandable, I mean, the amount of users exceeded everyone's expectations, and installing unnecessary access points when they are redundant is a waste of money. However, the University charged an extra fee to offset the cost of installation, bandwidth and maintenance. Every resident, regardless of whether or not they even owned a computer was charged this fee. The charged everyone to operate it, but expected basically no one to use it. It was complete *****. However, when there's over 1500 people on a wait-list to get into a 1100 person residence, the university can pretty much do as it pleases.
That network was ***** beautiful for P2P and LAN games, though. - brickbat, on 03/11/2008, -2/+1ok, so I'm using a non standard port and I'm forcing encryption. WTF exactly, are they going to block?
- cornswalled, on 03/11/2008, -7/+1I find it fascinating that, with rare exceptions, the folks babbling about how "information wants to be free" are themselves talentless morons who never produce ANYTHING of value.
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+5I think the developers of Linux are a lot more talented then you, they have produced free products, used in the real world. I have contributed to Linux and open source project and a lot more talented then you.
- cornswalled, on 03/11/2008, -7/+1They have produced an unstable, cobbled together mess built from stolen code and copied interfaces. It's a rewrite of 40 year old technology (Unix) and an attempt to undermine stable, copyrighted software. It's more anti-corporate, socialist / communist philosophy than an actual operating system. It's popularity is based on the fact that it can be copied and used for free without the BSA coming after you, even though it's inferior and hard to use.
Don't try to use that pathetic pile of garbage as "proof" of anything.- Kurlumbenus, on 03/11/2008, -2/+1No proof is needed to identify a troll. ***** off and die.
- cornswalled, on 03/11/2008, -2/+1Awww, did I offend the little Communist?
- Kurlumbenus, on 03/11/2008, -1/+1Nope. I might even agree with you, but you're only here to get negative attention. I don't even think you believe what you're saying. You're empty calories in this discussion, no content mindless aggression. So please go die in a fire.
PS ***** communism.
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1Microsoft have also produced an unstable cobbled together mess built from stolen code and copied interfaces( oo vista reminds me of os x)
Windows is also based on Unix OS, yep, 40 year old technology even exists in you windows. OS X is based on Unix as well!
Windows also uses TCP/IP from a BSD lisence. Yep, if it wasnt for open source software, your windows computer wouldn't be able to connect to the Internet!
So because you paid for it, don't mean it is better!- cornswalled, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1I just did some checking and Windows NT used code form BSD. It was rewritten and replaced for Windows 2000 to enhance performance. Your info about the Windows code base is eight years out of date.
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+1Looks like my clock isn't synchronized with yours, my mistake!
- Kurlumbenus, on 03/11/2008, -2/+1No proof is needed to identify a troll. ***** off and die.
- cornswalled, on 03/11/2008, -7/+1They have produced an unstable, cobbled together mess built from stolen code and copied interfaces. It's a rewrite of 40 year old technology (Unix) and an attempt to undermine stable, copyrighted software. It's more anti-corporate, socialist / communist philosophy than an actual operating system. It's popularity is based on the fact that it can be copied and used for free without the BSA coming after you, even though it's inferior and hard to use.
- smotpoker1, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1By your way of thinking info has the criteria that you have to be talented to use it.What are your values?Why should we care, the info is free and will be free as long as people talk/chat/write/video/sing/P2P/post...
- matx, on 03/11/2008, -1/+5I think the developers of Linux are a lot more talented then you, they have produced free products, used in the real world. I have contributed to Linux and open source project and a lot more talented then you.
- NFLSuperFan, on 03/11/2008, -1/+3I will never again purchase another CD.
- Nylon20, on 03/11/2008, -1/+0How ***** noble.
- peppersauce, on 03/12/2008, -0/+0Haven't purchased one for years, (apart from blanks). They're a shabby way to store music unless it's simply a temporary transfer medium or backup and nothing can justify the prices they've charged over the last thirty years. £15 in the early nineties to replace the classic vinyl that you already own with a nice 'digital' cd copy, how kind of the record companies to make this available to us!
They'll never shut down music sharing. There are still blokes in pubs around the country selling a dvd full of every top 40 album and single for a couple of quid! :-) - smackafiyah, on 03/12/2008, -0/+1That will stick it to the man...
- zeabu, on 03/11/2008, -0/+3I will never ever anymore buy CDs nor DVD, nor anything else from labels-
- smotpoker1, on 03/11/2008, -0/+3Just tell the riaa,it's lobbyists,it's bribed senators and reps,it's judges to go to hell.***** you riaa!!!you ***** *****!
- pauricthelodger, on 03/11/2008, -0/+0For more info on this, go to http://www.digitalrights.ie/ Hopefully we can stop these eejits starting this ***** over here too.
- microchp, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1For the love of music, stop using P2P. Start using encryption. It's that simple.
- AnonthePyro, on 03/12/2008, -0/+1*****. THIS IS THE GODDAMN INTERNET. IT SHOULDN'T BE RESTRICTED LIKE THIS. *****.
- smg2, on 03/13/2008, -0/+0If eircom lose this the gates will be open and the other Irish ISPs will be forced to comply... If eircom cant stop this, everyone is screwed
- mhmdkhamis, on 06/07/2008, -0/+0I don't think these retards have a case against eircom. My only fear is our glorious court system might produce another howler of a decision as they seem to be doing frequently of late
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http://download.paramegsoft.com/ - lemonpies, on 07/25/2008, -0/+1Maybe the "BIG FOUR" should think about putting the same amount of effort into tracking down perverts on-line as they do lining musician's pockets with cash - you notice how sicko's are allow to share their child porn in pedo gangs accross networks and ISP's -yet "the law" (big money giants) are more interested in going after teenagers that share music... very sad world.
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