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Tasers are safe, says Taser International Inc

theglobeandmail.com — Taser manufacturer is taking legal action in response to "false and misleading headlines." I wonder if their chairman has ever been zapped by one?

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  • phnx0221, on 11/18/2007, -13/+114Really. Tasering is safe. Please, could you repeat that to these people? Let's start with him (warning- shock video that was popular a few days ago) http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=8080

    and this guy http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/20/2062.asp

    and this one http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/20 ...

    and this one http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-196470718 ...

    oh, and this one http://draves.org/blog/archives/000514.html

    and this woman http://www.local6.com/news/14147512/detail.html

    and this guy http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Top_News/2007/08/05/m ...

    These are all stories that were all previously made popular on Digg. Safe? No. Easily abused? Yes. Lethal? Yes. Even when non-lethal, does the pain feel like you are going to die? Yes. Do you think 50,000 volts might pose a risk to permanent injury, either external or internal? Yes.
    • capiCrimm, on 11/18/2007, -4/+43but why would Taser Inc lie?
      • stklaw, on 11/18/2007, -5/+11$$$
      • benplaut, on 11/18/2007, -1/+11Step 3: ???
      • LeeSoong, on 11/18/2007, -4/+1Taser Inc. promotes Tasers as ''Less Leathal'' weapons, less leathal than a 9mm Glock.

        Given the choice of a four or five bullets in your torso, or a Taser Zap, which one do you think is easier to survive?

        How to get a nice, warm police Welcome to Pittsburgh:
        http://youtube.com/watch?v=wUO0RZbTsgg

        Still better than five rounds to the chest.
        • AlexBellisBrown, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2They said Cigarettes were safe 50 years ago.... i wonder what they will say in the future about Tasers?
      • Tarnum, on 11/18/2007, -2/+6Tasers are safe says TASER Int'l
        Vioxx is safe says Merck & Co.
        Aspartame is safe says Monsanto & Merisant
        Celebrex is safe says Phizer
        Irradiation of food is safe, says ....
        Bovine growth hormone is safe too, doesn't promote tumor growth, says ...
    • ZachSka87, on 11/18/2007, -25/+3Only lethal to people so jacked up on drugs that they are probably going to die soon anyway. These peoples hearts exploded because of all the crack in their bodies. Tasering is safe unless you're a drug abusing jackass.
      • spyd3rweb, on 11/18/2007, -2/+8What about people on legal stimulants or other drugs?
        • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -8/+3Are you supposed to tox screen people before you confront them in their stimulant-fueled tantrums?

          I hear coffee puts me at higher risk of dying from gunshots, so please don't shoot me while I rob this bank. I just had a double-double.
      • silentdragoon, on 11/18/2007, -1/+9or what about the times it has been lethal to people without drugs in their system, as linked to above?
      • Gir53457, on 11/18/2007, -2/+6There is nothing safe about being tasered, however it is signifigantly less lethal than a gun and in most cases, less harmful than a billy club.
      • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -0/+6you didn't read the links that guy put out did you - one of them died of bullets and not a taser
      • WaltDismal, on 11/18/2007, -2/+5So what about the guy in a diabetic coma who was Tasered by the cops? You saying he was at fault? He was a druggie? I don't usually call people morons, but you're a candidate.
    • max420, on 11/18/2007, -13/+12I actually agree with the article, if you do watch the video from Vancouver International airport, you can clearly see that the man was not in a normal state. And they are right, if it was cardiac arrest caused by the device, the victim would have dropped pretty quick, as opposed to putting up the fight he did. Its much more likely that the officers man handling did more damage.
      • trogdoor, on 11/18/2007, -1/+10Specifically, it seemed that one officer had his knee on the man's neck .
    • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -4/+14Voltage isn't a good measure of danger. Touching a doorknob on a dry day can deliver 15,000 volts and that's not considered dangerous.
      • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -1/+8thats right its all about amps
        • Abomonog, on 11/18/2007, -4/+1Then you just do the math. It takes .002 amps to kill a person. You have a 50,000 volt taser weapon running that power through a 600 ohm resistor (the human body). I don't know the formula but I bet each zap injects a lethal current.
        • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -0/+4The body is more like a 600,000,000 ohm resistor.

          If 600 ohms were correct, then the 15,000 amp doorknob shock would induce 20 amps through your body and you'd be dead on the first dry day, a victim of shuffling your feet on carpet.
    • pkranger71, on 11/18/2007, -12/+8How about taking the time to look up how many lives it has saved? As when a officer has used it instead of a firearm even though the firearm would have been justified. Or disabling someone mentally disturbed who might have hurt himself or someone else. But nah that kind of stuff is boring and doesn't give folks something to squak about...
      • jaxcs, on 11/18/2007, -2/+5I fear tasering has become something of a common occurrence in law enforcement. They taser you for failing to comply to their demands. Won't leave a car to be searched, taser, won't leave an political gathering, taser. They taser old men, women, young kids, epileptics, drug addicts, you name it. All of this is done in the name of law enforcement, but I wonder if it isn't really to punish someone for making them break a sweat. If you fire a gun, my understanding is that every shot needs to be accounted for, is there similar accounting for taser? Is it even possible to regulate the hand held models?
        • J6stik, on 11/18/2007, -2/+3WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? do you know any of these people? have you seen all of this happen? i'm sorry, but i've been around cops, i've been in trouble with the law and i have probably way too many friends who have as well, and you're wrong. i've been with people who've refused to have their cars searched, or who've been asked to leave gatherings, and that doesn't really happen. maybe if you got your ass of digg once in a while for your source of knowledge you know some of this.

          and who the hell is this 'they' that you keep talking about?? 'law enforcement'? that's such a generalization. every city in America has it's own law enforcement which manages itself. there isn't some generic 'law enforcement' in an office somewhere in D.C. making rules about when or when not to tase people, and they just decided that the new policy is to tase 'old men, women, young kids, epileptics, drug addicts, you name it.' how do they know if someone's epileptic or a drug addict if they're resisting arrest? and if someone's cracked out, that's when tasers become most useful, because they're designed as non-lethal weapons.

          this is what i hate about digg. all of these seemingly solid arguments are completely vague and arbitrary.
        • jaxcs, on 11/19/2007, -2/+0It's just the news guy. Read the paper, check out the Internet, watch it on TV. You're here, you know how to google. Do you claim that no old person, woman, child, epileptic or drug addict has ever been tasered? Your comment regarding tasers being useful because "they've been designed as non-lethal weapons" is exactly part of the problem - you've been indoctrinated. Part of the training program is to be tased yourself. Since you found it to be extremely unpleasant, but didn't die, you regard it as non lethal. But the upshot of it is that you reach for the taser a little too readily. Instead of talking a suspect out of doing something stupid, you sit a little taller in the saddle and handle it with a taser.
          In regard to the person who got tased because she wouldn't leave her car, I saw a video of this on one of those COPS type shows on Spike TV. We've all seen the vid of the "Don't tase me, Bro" kid. I'm glad you've never seen any misuse of the taser but there are thousands of these in operation, do you really want to argue that not one has ever been misused?
    • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -4/+15Current kills, not volts.

      While you have some valid points. please stop using the voltage rating as an indication of potential harm. It's the fact that tasers are low amperage that they don't barbecue people @ 50kv. It's also a valid argument the risk of death from even those 50kv is low.

      But excuse me if basic electrical safety isn't welcome on the Ban Tasers train.
      • theciuffo, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2Yesterday, I rubbed my feet on the carpet and touched a doorknob. 10,000 volt shock. Tickled a little...
      • benitojuarez, on 11/18/2007, -1/+7mythbusters showed it take 6 milliamps across the heart to die from electrocution. 6 milliamps qualifies as low amperage doesnt it?
        • fatesdefiance, on 11/18/2007, -1/+8And a taser pulse delivers around 2 milliamps.
    • Murdats, on 11/18/2007, -6/+8your right, tasers are dangerous, lets just force cops to stick with guns and hard metal sticks to shoot people with and break peoples bones.
      • vertinox, on 11/18/2007, -2/+5Umm... Cops can't just shot people because they are annoyed with the suspect. Tasering on the other hand...
    • ydt89, on 11/18/2007, -0/+8It's not like a company is going to come out and say there product isn't safe...
    • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -10/+12# 0 - died of a knee to the neck
      # 1 - died of diabetic shock
      #2 - is number one again moving on
      #3 - is a google video error
      #4 - I'm pretty sure it was the bullets that killed him and not the taser
      #5 - ok tased 10 times in 2 minutes probably would kill you - cops fault not a 'deadly device' a rubber hose filled with sand is deadly in the wrong cops hands
      #6 - to locate page requested
      so basically you have on article about one woman getting killed with a taser and she was probably killed with more than one at once. please diggers ***** get over the taser thing unless it involves some ***** saying something stupid like "don't tase me bro" especially if that ass hole deserved it like don't tase me bro did.
      ***** I hate digg more and more every day - all of you reactionary idiots need to go back to my space or face book or were ever the hell you came from
      • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -8/+5PS if you joined in 2007 don't ***** try and add me as a friend just to shout spam me with your stupid submissions
        /end rant
        • jaxcs, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3how do you define a deadly device? According to you everything or nothing can be construed as a deadly device. A tidly wink is either completely benign or is a deadly device if I ram it into your eye. I think a deadly device is something that does a great deal more harm than is currently understood or to which is admitted.
      • lien, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2So tasers don't kill people, cops kill people?
    • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -3/+2also I am sick of people calling every stun gun a taser - STUN GUN != TO TASER. tasers come in 50,000 volts stun guns go up to 1.5 million
    • J6stik, on 11/18/2007, -8/+4oh, wow, digg, way to ***** stretch yourself. way to step outside of the expected replies and actually surprise me for once.

      jesus, the description: 'i wonder if their chairman has been zapped by one?' no ***** he hasn't, you dumbass. that's stupid. that's a stupid thing to say. why the ***** would he be tazed by one? he hires people to get tased by one to test it. he's the chairman, he doesn't have to do ***** like that.
      and then the string of responses.

      guy posts list of like 10 youtube videos and news stories of people dying from them. hey, you *****, 10 odd stories really doesn't compare to how many times tazers have worked perfectly. i've been at a movie theatre when a guy basically went ape ***** in the lobby and started freaking out. you know how they got him down? a taser. they tase him, and he went down and was handcuffed and the poor old lady with a purse and glasses right next to me wasn't physically assaulted. you think we all wanted to see a guy get shot and killed? you think we wanted to see a cop assualt/be assulted by someone? no, you ***** idiot, we wanted the guy to leave us the ***** alone. and by the way, solid ***** evidence. no studies or tests, just random news stories, practically viral ones at that.

      and then, of course, 'why would they lie?' with an implied 'lol i ***** burned them just now did you see that?' of course, '$$$' is the reason they said that. as if that's some huge proof that their chairman is a lying, greedy bastard. why the ***** else would they say that? does anyone honestly expect a Taser company to say that Tasers aren't safe? it would be a ***** stupid move, you idiot. of course they wouldn't say that.
      you all know what? cars weren't designed to kill people, but i bet i could more than a handful of news stories of people who died in automobile-related accidents. and if you asked the chairman of GM if his cars were safe or not, he'd say that they are. but people still die in car accidents. you know why? because some people ***** up when they're driving. sometimes they actually ***** up, or the road conditions are bad and they can't see a deer and it's foggy, or they're just dicks and trying to text their girlfriend while passing someone on the freeway in their SUV. just like sometimes cops tase people and it saves a whole lot of trouble for everyone around, or sometimes cops tase someone who's being a crazyass but happens to be faint of heart, or sometimes cops are way too quick to do something like tase someone and kill them, or sometimes some kid wants to get on youtube so he causes trouble and says 'dude, don't tase, bro, that would be a hella dick move to do if you tased me bro right now with that taser, dude.. with that TASER YOU'RE HOLDING PLEASE DON'T TASE ME BRO IS SOMEONE RECORDING THIS HOW MANY HITS DOES THIS VIDEO HAVE YET?????'

      you all are ***** tools and don't even know it. if you honestly looked at this story and got outraged at the Taser company, then you're a tool to the digg effect, which blindly praises the underdog and rides the ass of the generic big corporation and it's infinite greed and dominance over all of your freedoms. yeah, there are problems in the world, but blind opposition to an expected enemy isn't the answer. you *****.
      • ChrisWalkr, on 11/18/2007, -3/+4Get a blog.
      • TexTurboesq, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3You're gonna get dug dug down by all the pussy 'rally against the man' crowd, but I'm with ya.
    • CoolWind, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3Wow! That took me by surprise. A Taser friendly article on Digg.
      "Specifically in Canada, while previous incidents were widely reported in the media as 'TASER deaths,' the role of the TASER device has been cleared in every case to date". But don't let the facts confuse you. just ignore them.
    • phnx0221, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2I checked my original links before posting, but it has been brought to my attention from mikesbaker, that some of those links are faulty.

      Since#2 is a repeat of the diabetic shock, here is a different one http://abclocal.go.com/wtvg/story?section=local&id ...

      #3 google video error - I don't remember which video it was, so here's another case, of a teenager dying after being tasered by police in New Jersey http://www.kwqc.com/Global/story.asp?S=7306822

      #6 here's the UPI story, I'm not sure why the link didn't work the first time, but I'm going to try it again - http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Top_News/2007/03/17/m ...

      and, here is another one. http://www.aclu.org/police/abuse/26177prs20060717. ...

      • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1All those links are broken except the new #3 (thanks to Digg's awful link handling). And #3 has no information at all. There's no way to tell the circumstances and what caused this person's death. For all we know the roadrunner dropped an anvil on his head right after he was tased.
        • phnx0221, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Damnit! Really, I don't understand why that's happening. All of these links were good when I googled them, checked them, and linked them here. I haven't had this problem before, is there something I'm doing wrong?
          • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Digg is truncating the links. I know one way it does this, which is if you edit your post after posting it. There are likely other ways too. Digg's link handling is pretty messed up right now.
      • phnx0221, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Okay, I think I've figured it out. After posting the links in the comment, I went back in to edit it, and since I didn't re-copy and paste, it broke the links. I don't think it's necessary to post them all over again as the point has been made, but if you guys want me to, I will.
  • zappa717, on 11/18/2007, -12/+38This just makes me sick at my stomach. Tasers need to be banned! They are murdering people and getting away with it! Hail video!!!
    • ZachSka87, on 11/18/2007, -6/+8Read the article. The only way a taser can cause death is cardiac arrest, which would happen INSTANTLY upon tasering. True story. I swear most diggers are the most ignorant SOB's....commenting on ***** before even reading the damn articles.
      • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -2/+3Yup you're right. If a guy got a heart attack from a taser you'd know right away. In this instance, it's kind of hard to tell because they tackled the guy almost before the damn taser even finished its shock. This is why it's important to strike, then assess. This is why the double-tap for firearms was replaced by a single shot, assess, then another shot if required.
        • Gir53457, on 11/18/2007, -2/+5If you're in a situation where you need to pull out a gun, most people and even policemen will just empty the clip.
          • Wartyboskfapped, on 11/18/2007, -3/+2They are specifically trained to empty their clips.
          • LeeSoong, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3incorrect.

            Continuum of force training typically teaches the application of force until the opponent drops.

            Apply force until the opponent stops, typically 2 to 4 rounds.

            It would be poor form for an officer to continue emptying his clip into someone already laying on the ground after 3 or 4 hits.
          • demonsnake69, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Wouldn't emptying the magazine for one person be a waste of bullets?
      • anachronaut, on 11/18/2007, -2/+8Read the article...? You mean the propaganda provided by the manufacturer? That article? No one in their right mind should EVER take at face value the propaganda produced by corporations. Even if the words presented there are 100% factual -- and they almost certainly are, as they were probably vetted by their legal team -- they are only going to be "half truths" which have been carefully cherry-picked for their benefit.

        You're not really that gullible, are you? I could probably find some facts which would make cigarette smoking appear to be a healthy lifestyle choice if I tried hard enough. That doesn't necessarily make it "true" in an objective sense.
      • WaltDismal, on 11/18/2007, -0/+4@ZachSak: You have no idea what you're talking about. A Taser could cause ventricular fibrillation, but a person might not die immediately. However, if the nerves or heart were damaged, it could set the person up for a heart attack later.
    • emt1451, on 11/18/2007, -7/+9I am a paramedic and I have received training on tasers and treating possible injuries as a result of being tasered. Tasers do not kill people. The voltage cannot harm anyone.

      What is killing these people is called excited delirium. Since it's 3am and I just got home from working a 9 hour shift... below is a link to wiki explaining what ED is. I am quite appalled about how ignorant most diggers are and how willing they are to "blame the man" in a case that is clearly of no fault to the police officer or their equipment.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excited_delirium
      • anachronaut, on 11/18/2007, -2/+9And if I stick a knife in your jugular, it's not the knife killing you -- it'll be the loss of blood. What the heck was your point?
        • LeeSoong, on 11/18/2007, -3/+2no, it would be your target's failure to block the knife that would cause their death.

          Lazy, unskilled, slow moving target!
      • ta10n, on 11/18/2007, -1/+8I'm not sure I understand how that wikipedia entry explains how ED leads to a person dying when you taser them. Would you mind explaining it a bit further? The wiki entry seems to suggest that it's a very loosely accepted term used for really angry people who die in police custody. Even if someobody, is really delirious to the point of halucinations, uncontrollable anger, etc... they usually don't just die without some sort of catalyst right? If all these people who died post-taser weren't tasered, they'd still be alive no?
      • jaxcs, on 11/18/2007, -1/+5According to the very link you provide, ED is a controversial diagnosis. You are suggesting that if you are in an excited state, you might just die. But doesn't tasering push you over the precipice? And of course, if you can diagnose or suspect someone of ED, why do cops proceed to taser them? I can't see how this answers anything. Even accepting ED, tasers seems to be a major contributing cause.
      • Wartyboskfapped, on 11/18/2007, -3/+6You're a paramedic. You're not a doctor. You are the equivalent of a waitress where doctor = chef. Please don't blither on about non existent medical conditions such as excited delirium. There is no entry for ED in DSM IV. Would you use homeopathic medicine on a patient? That's the level of credibility ED has. It's crank science.
        • emt1451, on 12/27/2007, -0/+1Sorry, next time I won't treat people who have been tased. Thank you for the lesson.
      • WaltDismal, on 11/18/2007, -3/+6@emt: I don't know who you received your training from, but it is likely to be based at root upon information from Taser International. And their testing was based in part on research with PIGS, under the claim the physiology was similar enough to be reliable. But the fat distribution in pigs can shield their cardiac nerves differently, and the data was not independently verified by a non-military lab as far as I know. Furthermore, if the barbed electrodes penetrated exactly wrong, the depth of the electrode being deep enough between the ribs, the heart could get a substantial jolt. Also. the electric field from the Taser is affected by the moisture level in the skin, with moist skin between the electrodes diverting more current than if the skin were dry and the full potential went into the heart. And the effect on the nerves is affected by the duration and repetition of the charge. One burst might or might not have a bad effect, but multiple bursts are certainly more likely to interfere with cardiac function sometimes. There are many variables. But whoever gave the training had an agenda I think, that Tasers are safe. Nothing could be more wrong, in that some individuals are more susceptible than others to damage. If you examine safety rules for electrosex equipment, you'll find that voltages far lower than that of the Taser can kill if applied in the chest area. See Wikipedia topic: Erotic_electrostimulation.
      • phnx0221, on 11/18/2007, -1/+3From wikipedia regarding excited delirium and excessive force:

        "Some civil-rights groups argue that the term is being used to absolve police of guilt, in overly restraining people, during arrests. The cause of death only appears where police are involved in restraining individuals. [3] [4] This does not include those deaths in chemical dependence treatment, EMS, hospital, or psychiatric care facilities who die while being restrained or while in seclusion.

        Eric Balaban of the American Civil Liberties Union said: "I know of no reputable medical organization — certainly not the AMA American Medical Association or the American Psychological Association that recognizes excited delirium as a medical or mental-health condition." [3] Melissa Smith of the American Medical Association said the organization has "no official policy" on the disorder. [4]"
    • dekuscrub, on 11/18/2007, -11/+5Whatever. People who get tasered have it coming to them. Would you rather the cops use guns? What's next? You gonna take away their night sticks?
      Besides, it's just thugs getting lit up. They are a waste of life anyway.
    • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -2/+2why so that I have to by a gun for personal protection instead of a STUN GUN - oh but you want to ban those too - I guess its going to be a board with a nail in it then
  • Observant1, on 11/18/2007, -8/+65over 300 deaths by tazers in the last 18 months, and thats just the ones they admit! yeah friggin right these things are safe.. I'd feel safer bathing in blood then going surfing with sharks.
    • zeptobyte, on 11/18/2007, -3/+4So would I. Blood's not really that dangerous.
      • DucoNihilum, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2But sharks are...
        • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -0/+7Not really.

          Coconuts kill more people than sharks.
          • DucoNihilum, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Not when they bathe in blood and swim in a pool of them.
        • benplaut, on 11/18/2007, -0/+5No really. They're opportunistic feaders--if they're hungry, they'll eat whatever tastes good. If they're not, they won't eat. I "swim" with sharks fairly often, cleaning tanks.
          • Gir53457, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2You also wear chain mail I presume?
          • ydt89, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1its easier then asking the sharks if they happen to be hungry...
          • demonsnake69, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Hey benplaut, is it true that if a shark attacks you're supposed to punch it in the face?
          • DucoNihilum, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2You swim with them when incredibly bloody? Are you going to risk that absolutely none of those sharks is going to take a bite off you when they see a bloody seal (you) dying in front of them?
      • carnag3aus, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3Blood carries a lot of lethal viruses/diseases etc... so I dunno.
    • ZachSka87, on 11/18/2007, -3/+13300 huh? Where'd you get that number? Back it up with facts and stop pulling ***** out of your ass.
      • mikesbaker, on 11/18/2007, -3/+3its the new digg - jackasses just want to get outraged about something and then do nothing other than sitting on their asses to change something about it. remember how many 9/11 truth movement people there were on digg until the troofers got ripped to shreds - this is no different and will pass until some other stupidity for people to act like there is some need to change the world comes along. (oh and just like this they won't do ***** about it aside from spam each others shouts with stupid ass submission - I'm pretty close to leaving dig over the retarded circle jerk it has become - digg won't miss me and I will miss digg - digg when it wasn't over run idiots)
    • Pilot85, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1300? please source or gtfo.
    • TexTurboesq, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Cite sources or you're another loudmouth *****. No digg, ***** off.
  • brownsound00, on 11/18/2007, -9/+62Tasers are safe... what else are they gonna say next, Fox is news?
    • DucoNihilum, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2Technically Fox IS news.... (well, FNN is)
      • spyd3rweb, on 11/18/2007, -1/+4Their news is more entertainment and drama than it is information
        • RxDaniel, on 11/18/2007, -0/+4As is every "news" network on television.
    • ZachSka87, on 11/18/2007, -3/+3TASERING DOES NO MORE THAN A FRIGGIN STUN GUN. SAME DAMN VOLTAGE.
      • trogdoor, on 11/18/2007, -1/+4Voltage is not what is dangerous to you, static electricity has an extremely high voltage.
      • trogdoor, on 11/18/2007, -2/+2Voltage is not what is dangerous to you, static electricity has a very high voltage also.
    • J6stik, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2oh wow, there's some new material for you. i dislike fox as much as the next digger, but honestly, who the ***** HASN'T made a reference to fox being bad? jesus, that's completely irrelevant. and they do already say that fox is news, you dick. goddamnit, go ahead and bash whoever you want but at least be funny or witty about it or something.
  • frozenpxl, on 11/18/2007, -4/+68Of course they would say that, they're endorsing it.

    "The fighting is over," says the Bush administration.
    "I'm innocent," says O.J. Simpson.
    "We're fair and balanced," says Fox News.
    • hiphoc, on 11/18/2007, -4/+8Yea, this reminds me of when I am walking by someone with a pit bull and the owner says trust me he is freindly. My mohter got chased and bit by one of those... Trust me he's friendly bit. I have a weird feeling that somehow someone on Tazers board of directors will have CIA or Bush Crime Family links. Any takers on this bet?
  • EvanVolm, on 11/18/2007, -2/+36Tasers ARE safe, technically. It's when 8 police tackle a guy and suffocate him to death that does most of the harm....
    • Qtip42, on 11/18/2007, -0/+9by technically do you mean when they are not used on humans and just randomly shot at inanimate objects?
      • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -3/+7He's referring to the guy killed in Vancouver lately who was killed when a man held his knee on his neck. Despite this, people refer to it as a death by taser.
      • RxDaniel, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1I think by technically he means that a normal person when shot by a taser will not die. If they have a heart problem then yeah it might kill them. So could jumping out from behind a corner and scaring them.
        • mrurc, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2Jumping out from behind a corner probably wouldn't damage a pacemaker. It seems like an electrical shock could.
        • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -2/+1Wow, you're a genius. You thought of this and Taser didn't! Wow, 15 years on the market and no one thought of this!

          Oh wait, no, in actuality, the current is so low and only goes across the surface of the body that there is no risk to pacemakers.
    • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -1/+3I've heard, first hand, from people who have fought off 6 cops.

      If you're ***** around and want to fight with the cops, don't expect less than 4 of them to come at you. They're not going to drop gloves and go one on one.
      • Wartyboskfapped, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3hearsay.
      • mrurc, on 11/18/2007, -0/+5Yeah, man, that guy who got tasered while IN A COMA was asking for it!
    • mrurc, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3Unless you are elderly, have a heart problem, or are currently having a medical emergency for which the police should be taking you to the hospital instead of tasering you, yes. But since the cops can not know by looking at someone if they have a heart problem, they may as well be randomly lethal so far as the cops are concerned.
  • andrewcsayer, on 11/18/2007, -4/+47Cigarette is to health as what taser is to safe
    • Hayaemsay, on 11/18/2007, -2/+5But does this stop the users?
    • Takteek, on 11/18/2007, -2/+18Tasers are hazardous to your safe?
    • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -0/+12Tasers go down smooth, and make you look cool in a bar. I for one am a menthol taser person.
  • kwandar, on 11/18/2007, -4/+19Excited delerium? It isn't even a medical term (see Wikipedia definition), and is used to describe people under the influence of intoxicants (he had been in a secure area of the airport for 10 freakin hours - what intoxicants - the fumes of tasers?!) I can't believe these idiots have the audacity to say he shows signs of it, and I hope to hell his mother sues the crap out of them too!! No more tasers ANYWHERE if this is the type of attitude their manufacturer exhibits!
    • RxDaniel, on 11/18/2007, -1/+3Yeah i wish they would just go back to beating people with night sticks when they don't comply.
      • jaxcs, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3You're joking but I really wonder if that isn't true. night sticks leave marks that are readily visible and understood, death by electrocution isn't.
  • Qtip42, on 11/18/2007, -4/+19...excited delirium...rrrright......You mean they're excited after getting tased.....if I just got tased, I wouldn't play dead and wait for it again, I'd get into fight or flight mode.
    • Murdats, on 11/18/2007, -3/+1apparently you dont use thinking mode, tasers paralyse you, you are going to stop the cops tasering you by fighting them some more? they will just take your body away from you again till you do sit down and shut up.
      • mrurc, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3No, they cause involuntary muscle responses. Maybe we should test one on you and see.
    • theciuffo, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1That's a great idea, fight cops. Meaning put them in physical harm if they get near you. That might make them want to use a device that can subdue someone at a great distance....
  • kanimara, on 11/18/2007, -2/+21they are safe!
    except when they kill people.
    but i mean really, 99.9999%... feel free to taser your friends and family when they annoy you.
  • Jareth86, on 11/18/2007, -2/+17So tase him. Lets see him put his money where his mouth is.
    • GirthAgain, on 11/18/2007, -1/+6Not just how they tase the cops when they are 'training.' Tase him for 2 minutes straight while keeping a knee to his chest, just like the pigs do to the citizens.
    • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -1/+6He's been tasered 10-15 times. See link below.
      • garbanzo, on 11/18/2007, -1/+4no link. Not that it matters. He should be tased daily just to show it's still safe.
    • whorunbartertwn, on 11/18/2007, -1/+0Sheesh Happy you sure deflated the "he should get tazed!" thing quickly. Now it's gotta be daily.
  • kahlessreborn, on 11/18/2007, -4/+20Tobacco is safe says Marlboro
  • phrogxix, on 11/18/2007, -12/+5Don't tase me bro.
  • Aspire36, on 11/18/2007, -4/+20Taser's are just as safe as any other weapon used to beat up innocent people.
    • RxDaniel, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2They are also safer than most weapons people use against cops that are trying to protect innocent people.
    • theciuffo, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3Next time I get in trouble with the cops, I'm going to make sure I'm guilty, that way I don't get tasered!
  • HerrEisenheim, on 11/18/2007, -4/+11Safe? No. Safer than 155gr JHP .40 S&W? Yes.
    • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -3/+3Dugg for Truth.

      If you want to ban tasers, suggest a totally safe alternative. Go on, I dare ya.

      And don't say negotiation and proper training. This is for when diplomacy fails.
      • testcase, on 11/18/2007, -1/+4Wrong! The policer are tasering FIRST. That's the big problem. There is no diplomacy.
        • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1I didn't say that asshats don't shoot first and ask questions later. Like you, apparently.
        • Balanced, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2You're making a very wide statement by saying that"Police are tasering first." It's presumably only a few out of thousands going against policy.
      • garbanzo, on 11/18/2007, -0/+5Asshats that shoot first with tasers aren't usually stupid enough to do the same thing with a sidearm. The real problem is that police officers are told that tasers are safe. They tase each other in training to prove it. When they get out among the general public they trust their training and kill people for no reason.
      • vertinox, on 11/18/2007, -0/+4@"Go on, I dare ya."

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PHaSR
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sticky_foam

        Ok... I'm sure you could die if they shot the sticky foam in your mouth, but its way less lethal than a taser. And less prone for abuse.
        • demonsnake69, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1If a cop pointed that PHaSR at someone I'm sure the perp would laugh himself to death and they'd be considered lethal.
    • lien, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2It is also safer than the 155mm M109 A3, you still have to be careful when using the taser.
  • iceman0113, on 11/18/2007, -14/+2They're only safe if you're on the receiving end of them.
  • ZenMojo, on 11/18/2007, -2/+29Tasers are safe compared to guns, which is what tasers are designed to replace. Tasers are not safer than mace, batons, handcuffs (only one person killed by handcuffs, how many by tasers?), or even a punch to the face. It's retarded when your first resort is a semi-lethal measure.
    • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -1/+6Handcuffs are a restraint, not a method of subduing someone. Handcuffs come into play after the person is subdued.

      Punches to the face are VERY dangerous, both to the cop and the civilian.
    • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -1/+6Close quarters confrontations can escalate the need to use force.

      Just sayin'. Yes, tasers can kill. Any electric shock can kill, but at this current the risk is low.

      The same could be said about dying from a solid punch that concusses you. Or the instances where officers are shot with their own weapons from engaging in close quarters.

      Videos like this though do stir up emotion. High-voltage, low-current shocks in reality are not likely to kill you. They hurt like hell though, and make you lose muscle control, and flop like a fish for the camera. But you will never, ever find a totally safe way of incapacitating someone once they're beyond reasoning with.
      • emt1451, on 11/18/2007, -3/+1"Any electric shock can kill, but at this current the risk is low."

        No, at that current there is no risk.
    • Murdats, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1punch to the face - in australia there are talks of bringing in "1 hit laws" because we have had incedinces where someone has king hit someone and killed them in 1 punch, safe yeah.
      batons - may have less deaths, but how much in medical bills from broken bones, smashed up faces and not to mention things like cracked skulls or concussion
      mace - does stop someone slashing randomly with a knife, doesnt stop someone charging, and doesnt allow you to stop the pain once they have complied, but it is the safest you have mentioned, also the least effective though
      and as mentioned, unless you are using the handcuffs as nunchucks, they are not a weapon, they are a restraint, how do you get them on someone who is not complying?
    • whorunbartertwn, on 11/18/2007, -0/+0I think I'd take a taser over being beaten into submission by batons.
  • RandomTaskMan, on 11/18/2007, -12/+5Don't Sue Me Bro!
  • scecilio, on 11/18/2007, -6/+14I prefer a tasering to being shot or having the crap beaten out of me with blunt instruments.
    • garbanzo, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3I prefer to be left alone, since I'm like not breaking any laws or threatening anyone's safety or anything. I shouldn't have to worry that if I get lost in an airport the police will come tase me.
      • mrurc, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2Or if you are in a diabetic coma on the bus.
      • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1He was throwing chairs and destroying computers. That's breaking laws.
  • pintomp3, on 11/18/2007, -5/+21tasers are safe, and water boarding is not torture. wtf. i guess water won't be wet for long.
  • lazyfisherman, on 11/18/2007, -3/+18Tazers are ok but dealing with the police is unsafe.
  • Pobotrol, on 11/18/2007, -1/+11Everything is beautiful and nothing hurts.
  • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -4/+10Tasers are a relatively safe option thats main issue is it is usually used in what is already a dangerous situation. Sometimes people are injured or die when being subdued, taser or no.

    What we can ask is that cops only use tasers when the danger (to the cop or civilian) would be higher if the taser is not used. If that holds, then the relative safety of tasering will allow us to minimize the harm caused to civilians and cops in these situations.

    But what we don't need is a bunch of people watching grainy videos on the internet and passing judgment that a particular tool should not be used.

    Also, in response to the question in the summary, I would be willing to make a bet that the head of Taser International Inc. has submitted to being tasered before.
    • Truegod, on 11/18/2007, -2/+2Wow, a voice of reason. It's almost like you took time to think about you opinion, rather then passing judgment based on a sensationalist headline... You must be new to Digg or something.

      Seriously though, you make a really good point.
    • WRXFiles, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1 x
    • buckrogers1965, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2Yes, we do need citizens looking at what happened after the fact and passing judgment on it. This is what happens in a democracy.
  • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -0/+9I would say the taser, the pressure of being tackled by the police, and the fact that he had his airway obstructed, all contributed to the cardiac arrest.
    • garbanzo, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2nah, it was just that he thought he was coming to a civilized country and died of shock when the torture gestapo showed up
  • spyd3rweb, on 11/18/2007, -4/+5Maybe they wont object to being tasered in the nuts then. I mean its safe right?
    • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -2/+2Hurt like hell, but likely won't kill you.
    • theciuffo, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1Yes, it's safe, that doesn't mean it won't hurt. By the same line of logic, cops should be reduced to arming themselves with pillows. That's about the only thing that wouldn't hurt in the nuts.
    • Balanced, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1Actually, I've heard that training to carry a taser in some ares does require being tased before they allow the police to carry it.
    • whorunbartertwn, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1You pick then spyd... taser in the nuts or a swing from a police baton in the nuts.
  • HumanRecall, on 11/18/2007, -3/+5it's pretty bad when this happens in Canada for people to stand up and demand answers !!

    ***** like this has been going on in the U.S for the last 18 months ..people being wrongfully arrested and killed due to a Taser GUN

    Yet there was no out cry like this !! RCMP inadvertently kill someone in an arrest that was garnered to the situation and the whole World is turned upside down !!

    WTF !!!
    • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2I'm sure it's been going on for quite a while in Canada. People have just been deluding themselves into thinking that their own country is above all this.
  • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -0/+16TASER CEO Tom Smith:

    "I have been Tasered about probably between 10-15 times over the years intentionally."

    http://www.fool.com/investing/small-cap/2004/11/01 ...

    (In response to the summary)
    • garbanzo, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3about + probably = *****
    • 0004, on 07/04/2008, -0/+2Maybe so, but the key phrase here is "OVER THE YEARS". That means since 1993 when the company was established.
      Tell him to have them all applied in the space of under 5...10 minutes and see if he is still alive after. I highly doubt it.
    • whorunbartertwn, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1You guys crack me up... when the cries of "he should be tased" get answered so soundly you quickly shift to how often he's been tased or whether it's lies that he's been tased.
    • crapmatic, on 11/18/2007, -0/+3"I have been Tasered about probably between 10-15 times over the years intentionally."

      Thankfully working for Taser International, he knows how to adjust the voltage down from 50,000 to 50 volts.
    • NotADoctor, on 11/19/2007, -0/+1Rick Smith (one of the CEOs of Taser Inc) said in 2005 on Triple J's news program 'hack' that he gets every single taser device tested on himself before it gets released. That was over 60 different products back then. There used to be a video on taser.com of him and other members of management being taser but I can't find it. Anyone else remember that?
  • Zuljin, on 11/18/2007, -6/+3You know what, statistically, is more dangerous than a TASER, both in regards to death or lasting injury?
    Pretty much every other option, including plain old physically subduing.
    • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -0/+6Pepper spray. The pain lasts a hulluva lot longer.. the only problem is if you spray a guy enough times, he's going to develop some sort of resistance.
      • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2Fail.

        Pepper spray in enclosed spaces, or downwind of the target, can backfire. Gaseous weapons aren't for all situations.
        • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -0/+4FAIL
          Pepper spray don't always come in gaseous form in fact they are RARELY gaseous. They are water based and come out in a stream. They have a strong enough spray to resist wind.
        • bromac, on 11/18/2007, -1/+2Resisting wind isn't the same as being impervious.

          Just being in the vicinity will make your eyes and nose water.

          And I'm just passing on anecdotes from police officers I know that have had their pepper spray backfire at times. Go back to your book knowledge. I'm sure it'll keep you safe.
          • Asianwaste, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1Oh, so you never really handled the stuff have you? Compare anecdotes to actually being exposed to the stuff and using the stuff. I know how to handle OC and what to do when and if it backfires. If you are using it to the point where it backfires on you then you are too damn close and are also likely to seriously injure the person from hydraulic needles.
      • trogdoor, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1http://www.seattleweekly.com/1999-02-17/news/death ...
      • Zuljin, on 11/19/2007, -0/+0Pepper spray isn't effective enough. There are far more cases of pepper-sprayed people who continued to advance/assault/whatever and were shot than people who have died of TASERs.
        And then, as mentioned, it has other limitations.
        And TASERs vary rarely kill on their own. The Vancouver example had other factors, and other cases are almost invariably on peolpe taking drugs who already have cariovasculer problems.
        • Asianwaste, on 11/19/2007, -0/+1I was actually pointing out that it's not more dangerous. Yes I've seen people keep going, swinging blindly after a spray to the face. In my opinion the Asp is your best friend. It's just it'll cause more damage than a taser.
          Funny story that's related to both topics. OC used to be oil based. A long time ago some guy sprayed on a suspect. The suspect kept going so the cop naturally escalated to a taser. The combination of the two lit the guy's face up. Supposedly legend has it that's why they are all water based now.
  • bonds, on 11/18/2007, -6/+5Don't blame me, bro!
  • draculthemad, on 11/18/2007, -1/+10Tasers are relatively safe, and are a lot less likely to cause any permanent harm than chemical agents or blunt-force trauma.
    Thats what they are designed to replace. The idea is you taser someone instead of having to punch them in the face.

    The problem is that a some officers are regarding them as a magic wand and abuse them. A fireplace poker is a device, but some people have been killed when it was used as a improvised weapon, or used it as an implement of torture.

    They are "safe", not "harmless", as they do cause excruciating temporary pain. The problem is the few asshat cops that think safe gives them an excuse to use them carelessly.
  • HeresyInc, on 11/18/2007, -7/+14How many people here are Taser certified? I am. How many have been tasered? I have twice.
    In the two training sessions I attended I've seen at least 30 people tasered of various ages and physical conditions. Not a single person was injured or hurt. The pain level is much lower than that of pepper spray, pepper foam, and pepper ball never mind a hit from a baton. I have experienced all of these and I would much rather be tased than any of the other less than lethal weapons carried by my fellow law enforcement officers.
    • jaxcs, on 11/18/2007, -4/+4Have you ever been tasered several times in a under a minute and then be body slammed to the ground because that's the real life situation.
    • whorunbartertwn, on 11/18/2007, -4/+0Stop that HereyInc, your facts and real life experience isn't matching up with all the BS claims by the kneejerk retards. It's lethal because they say so dammit.
  • bingobongony, on 11/18/2007, -5/+6They are...It is like claiming that airline travel is not safe right after a plane crash. The fact of the matter is, tasters have saved FAR more lives, and far more serious injuries (both to cops/innocent civilians AND to the suspects) than other methods of restraining uncooperative suspects.
  • Gigabutt, on 11/18/2007, -2/+3Here's my idea: use pepper spray.
    • Truegod, on 11/18/2007, -0/+2Pepper spray doesn't work on anyone who is intoxicated or has a high pain tolerance. In fact pepper spray training usually involves being trained to fight through the pain. Pain compliance is not a good answer and could cause the situation only to escalate.
  • cjschmidt, on 11/18/2007, -3/+10Good lord. Nothing on this planet is f'ing safe. A toaster can kill you if I beat you with it. Peanut butter can kill if you're allergic to it.
    The REAL problem is that Police officers are not being trained properly on how and when taser use is appropriate. Tasers are a GOOD thing. Even the really good, well-trained good cops can't defend themselves with sunshine and lollipops. Luckily, when your retarded cousin gets tanked on cold medicine and attacks a cop with a baseball bat, that officer has an option other than his shotgun.
    Maybe if a video showing some asshat beating up an old lady with a toaster makes it to the front page you can all take your whiney bleeding-heart outrage to congress to get those damn toasters banned once and for all. We could even start an online petition!
    • mal1964, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1You mean the killing machine, toaster is just a cover name. the killing machine can kill you more ways than it can toast food items.
  • kberry67, on 11/18/2007, -1/+6I've been tazed before. I'd rather be tazed than have pepper spray used on me, personally. Mostly because tazing only hurts while they're doing it, pepper spray hurts for a long time.
  • mal1964, on 11/18/2007, -2/+2Why didn't the Phaser ever catch on with the police departments?. its worked flawlessly for over forty years.
  • DiogenesJr, on 11/18/2007, -0/+14Back in my former life of law enforcement, I was Taser certified. I have been tased and it is the most excruciating pain I have ever felt in my life. I have been pepper sprayed, shot with pepper ball launchers, hit with batons, picked up and thrown across the room by the defensive tactics instructor, you name any law enforcement device or method short of a gun and chances are I've taken a hit from it. I was always of the mind set that I'm not going to do something to another human being if I didn't know what it felt like first. It seemed only fair that way.
    Being tased was so bad that I will never do it again voluntarily. A female officer that was attending the class with me said that she would rather give birth again than be hit with a taser. I know there are probably some smart kids out there that'll say that I'm a pu**y and that they eat tasers for breakfast, but that fact is, I would rather be pepper sprayed or kicked in the crotch that hit with that infernal thing again.
    Of all of the things I've been certified on, Taser was my favorite. Unlike most devices or methods, the Taser training material consisted of a power point presentation produced by Taser Inc. It was mostly videos of people being tased. It was the one time I felt dirty in a training class; the whole thing was a taser commercial.
    Having said that, though, I don't believe that they more harmful than anything else when employed properly. You don't want to tase a ninety year old woman in a wheel chair or someone hooked up to a dialysis machine, but I've met people who've been tased numerous times in a night and they recovered. The issue is training law enforcement to use this tool appropriately.
    • 89992, on 11/18/2007, -0/+5Which is exactly why there needs to be laws restricting their use.
      • DiogenesJr, on 11/18/2007, -2/+1Laws aren't the answer. Good departmental policies that are enforced appropriately by administrations that operate transparently are the answer.
  • Wyndikan, on 11/18/2007, -4/+5And if you don't comply, we'll taze you to death!
  • aoki4, on 11/18/2007, -5/+6Ugh, Digg makes me sick. The first few comments are totally uninformed "lol police state sux ban tasers" ***** yet they get dugg up consistently. Then the posts towards the end that are actually truthful go unrecognized.
    • theciuffo, on 11/18/2007, -1/+1yeah, I noticed that too. My solution? www.digg.com/technology that's where the good stuff is.
  • bremstrong, on 11/18/2007, -2/+5The suggestion "I wonder if their chairman has ever been zapped by one?" is pointless. What does it matter if the chairman has been tasered? Of course he knows tasers are painful and incapacitating, that's the point.

    The headline is equally misleading. The statement the taser firm made has nothing to do with if tasers are safe, it only concerns the cause of the tragic death in Vancouver.

    The company claims the taser didn't kill him because he was still moving after being tasered. They claim his death was somehow related to "excited delirium", whatever that is. There is no way they know that the taser didn't contribute to his death, since they don't even know why the man died, so their statement is completely bogus.

    The issue isn't if tasers are "safe" or not. They are obviously not safe if they've involved in the death of hundreds of people. The issue is if they are being overused, and it seems obvious that they are given all the videos of fairly harmless looking unarmed people being killed. It is now totally free for the police to use the taser, like being at an all-you-can-eat taser buffet.

  • glory, on 11/18/2007, -7/+2Don't tase me bro!
  • Wyndikan, on 11/18/2007, -6/+2And if you don't comply, we'll taze you to death!
  • marcomc2, on 11/18/2007, -7/+3I am drunk.
    Just that there is an article called "Tasers are safe, says Taser Internation Inc", is horrible.
    • TexTurboesq, on 11/18/2007, -0/+1I am drunk = I'm trolling craig'slist for incall in my area.
  • d3faultnet, on 11/18/2007, -6/+1I've been tasered by taser international before. they had a booth and i volunteered to do it. it wasn't that bad... you just kinda can't move at all when it's happening. also, i can almost guarantee you that their chairman has had it done to himself before. It's mildly fun :-P
  • Frostman3D, on 11/18/2007, -2/+3Yeah, phillip morris said the same ***** about cigarettes. I call *****!
  • HappyScrappy, on 11/18/2007, -0/+5I remember back in the 80s when politicians were banning the use of submission holds by police officers because they were dangerous and overused. I wonder if maybe that was the wrong move now. It might be possible to use some of these submission holds more safely than a Taser at times.
  • WolfHook, on 11/18/2007, -3/+1http://blog.wired.com/defense/2007/11/introducing- ... If this goes into production I am buying shares!
  • teaBagger, on 11/18/2007, -4/+6If Tasers are outlawed, only outlaws will have Tasers

    /endsarcasm
  • shellwe, on 11/18/2007, -5/+0good digg!
  • cl2yp71c, on 11/18/2007, -2/+6Cocaine is also safe...says my friendly-neighborhood-drug-dealer.
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