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Military Considering Purple Hearts For Soldiers With Psychol

online.wsj.com — The military is debating whether to award one of the nation's top military citations, the Purple Heart, to veterans with psychological wounds as the number of troops diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder rises.

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  • crapmatic, on 05/14/2008, -8/+44"Can psychological traumas, no matter how debilitating, be considered equivalent to dismembering physical wounds?"

    Gee, didn't we learn anything about shell shock in World War I? Seeing one of your buddies blown up surely is more traumatic in the long run than a gunshot wound through the arm.
    • Asvetic, on 05/14/2008, -14/+8Here's an award for not dying out there. Yeah, that seems about right.
    • JoeVet, on 05/14/2008, -18/+11And we learned in WWI that you don't coddle those who suffer from shell shock. You allow them to rest and then you get them back to their units as quickly as possible. Rewarding it with a medal would cause more harm to those suffering psychological insult.
      • matschig, on 05/14/2008, -2/+11How?
      • CryRightardCry, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3*****.
        What kind of moron argues that a total LACK of psychological assistance is better than some?
        Or do you consider the state of the art of WWI medicine to be the ultimate in medicine?
        This explains a lot. Maybe idiots like this are in charge of our troops NOW.
        That would explain a LOT.
        Plus you are just making this crap up and you know it.
        • JoeVet, on 05/15/2008, -0/+2Returning shell shocked soldiers to their units as quickly as possible is current army protocol. Studies done in WWI lead to the conclusion that those who were reunited with their units recovered quicker than those who were taken out of the fight permanently. Any army medic will tell you that.
    • taradisiac, on 05/14/2008, -25/+4Oh booo ***** hooo, I've seen worse stuff on the movies.
      • litkaj, on 05/14/2008, -1/+10Seeing on a screen where you know it's fake and experiencing in person are completely different things. I'm surprised you haven't been dug down yet.
      • Marinium, on 05/14/2008, -0/+6Wow. Congratulations! I don't usually slam the individual for their comments but that has got the be one of the most sincerely stupid things I've ever seen anyone post. Good Job on that at least.
      • lhbaker, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1More idiocy where that came from: http://digg.com/users/taradisiac
    • Charun, on 05/14/2008, -0/+9In WW2 the RAF called it Lack of Moral Fibre. They wanted to attach a stigma to it so it wouldn't be reported.
    • whiterice0, on 05/14/2008, -2/+5Patton would have been disgusted!
    • wicketr, on 05/14/2008, -3/+6Yea, but can't they separate the medals. The Purple Heart for physical trauma, and the Pink Heart for emotional trauma? I don't see the point in combining the two types of injuries into one medal when they haven't been for so long.
      • Sinscriven, on 05/14/2008, -1/+6The purple heart is symbolic of honoring a person's sacrifice in service of their country; I'd bet that if there was a "pink heart" it'd be more like a brand of insanity than one of respect. Who's going to be proud of wearing the "I'm not mentally stable" medal?

        I don't see why it should be separated. One's sanity is just as valid a sacrifice as one's shot arm, or amputated leg, probably even more so. You can live with a lost limb, or even get a new one, but nobody can fix your mind and emotions; and medications are just a way to keep you in a sedated dreamland and out of your own reality.
        • shaka999, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3Your comment says it all. Who would want to wear the purple heart if it COULD be a "I'm not mentally stable" medal.

          They have to get rid of the stigma first then adjustments can be made...
      • ZenMojo, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1If you get a purple heart for forgetting to duck when someone shoots at you, they should give you a purple heart for forgetting not to go insane from watching your best friend blow up from a direct RPG hit.
  • chanop, on 05/14/2008, -4/+44"Here's a purple heart, now go deal with your problems elsewhere"
    • jeebus, on 05/14/2008, -3/+5You're absolutely right. It's like the military want's to give out Participation Ribbons and not deal with the real issue of having PTSD'd soldiers that need to re-integrate into society.
    • 955701, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2That's totally unfair. I mean, can't you get to get one of those neat "purple heart" license plates if you get this? And the postage stamps. Without the actual purple heart, you'd never have the whole collection!
    • NaziHatinChimp, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1"Lately I have had thoughts of suicide and I don't know where to go..."
      "Um yeah, good luck with that."
    • ReligionOfPeace, on 05/14/2008, -0/+5no blood, no ribbon. I don't want one. I just wish they'd pick up the tab for the anti-psychotics.
    • unreg, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3This is really just a matter of protocol. The Purple Heart is awarded for wounds received in the course of combat. If one considers the psychological impact of war as a wound (I would), then the Heart should be awarded.

      The headline is a bit over the top though, the Purple Heart hardly ranks as a top military honor. Frank Burns tried to get one twice.
    • 11b1p, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2well said! It would be more beneficial to help rehab these soldiers.
      • ReligionOfPeace, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1don't want the rehab either. just give me the drugs. they are a strain to my budget.
    • Drew10th, on 05/19/2008, -0/+0The Army has many options for soldiers suffering from PTSD. We recieve screenings before during and after each deployment as well as have mandatory interviews with health care providers behind closed doors. Further more every NCO that I know including myself encourages soldiers with PTSD symptoms to seek help through the councilors, chaplins, medical professionals ect. that the army has in place. NCO's are responsible for there subordinates and we take that duty very seriously.
  • chdodd2012, on 05/14/2008, -2/+51I think that would be changing the definition of the purple heart. Maybe a different award could be given- PTSD is an awful thing to live with.
    • Anonchrist, on 05/14/2008, -4/+13I know of quite a few soldiers that dislike the purple heart. To them it is a sign of shame and a reminder that they failed. (Then again that is probably a result of a psychological disorder.) Still, if they made it a different award then it might be insulting... Well, here is your you are a ***** nut-case award... Sad yes, but would someone laugh at it?
      • unreg, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3Can you cite evidence to your claim? The Purple Heart is awarded for wounds received in combat. How is that shameful or a sign of failure?

    • geolittle, on 05/14/2008, -12/+4How about the Yellow Belly?
    • skabyss, on 05/14/2008, -2/+8Award them with free prescription medications.... of their own choosing.
    • ElectricC0wb0y, on 05/14/2008, -0/+5If they gave this award out, then it would be to make the American people feel better (or even just the soldiers families). Not the soldiers themselves.
    • KhanneaNL, on 05/14/2008, -9/+6Many rightwing americans, salt of the earth, would probably give out a "pink ***** coward marshmellow heart". They live way back in the last century.
      • HarryBauzonia, on 05/14/2008, -3/+6You have good ideas....but it's spelled "marshmallow".
        • KhanneaNL, on 05/15/2008, -2/+1Oh ok. I am dutch, I am doing the best I can :)
      • VinceNoir, on 05/14/2008, -9/+4Yup. Not much more to say about that, than you nailed the right-wingers. They could give a ***** about a person's life if that person wasn't "man enough" to make it through a war as a hero. Nevermind the fact that not everyone can be a hero. They're only "pro-life" when you're talking about money making babies. When those babies grow into adults who don't have much going for them and they're forced into the military to survive, the right wingers don't care as much. (Note I'm talking about poor and uneducated soldiers who don't want to be in the military, not middle class career soldiers. They are two totally different animals).
        • unreg, on 05/14/2008, -2/+6Thanks for the stereotyping.
        • jerger23, on 05/15/2008, -1/+3I agree, great use of the paintbrush to stereotype conservatives.
          It's also a good thing that Vince knows so much about the different kinds of soldiers and how some are forced into military service at gunpoint just because they're poor and stupid. Thank goodness they aren't allowed to make a career out of the military like the smart volunteers from the middle class.
          /sarcasm
  • warkwark, on 05/14/2008, -39/+71Old Vet: "I have a bullet wound from fending off 50 Nazis"

    New Vet: "Yeah? Well, I cried a whole lot"
    • orbcolin, on 05/14/2008, -10/+17It's not being considered for crying, but for lifelong debilitating emotional pain. There is a big difference.
      • zantos420, on 05/14/2008, -1/+7and you don't think the bullet wound while having 50 nazis breathing down your trench closing in on your position threatening your life with mortar shells going off in all directions and seeing your friends die around you... you are right, that is way different..
        • LonesomeFighter, on 05/14/2008, -5/+1different peoples brains can deal with it differently. Some are born ok with killing and losing friends, some get mentally ***** up. You won't know till it happens. Plus Nazi's wore uniforms and you knew who they were. Terrorists wear civilian clothing making it near impossible to detect, and at the last second blow themselves up taking your friends and many civilians with them. It is a completely different kind of war.
        • unreg, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2Point missed. Thanks for trying.
        • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4No one should ever be OK with losing a friend or killing someone but it is a necessary evil of war. You just learn to deal with it.
        • Chrontius, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1You just learn to deal with it.

          Or you don't.
    • Tyr7BE, on 05/14/2008, -7/+17Indeed - I'm pretty sure a lot of solid old dudes who performed ridiculous acts of bravery would be pissed to see kids getting the same award that they did, but because they couldn't take the heat.
      • unreg, on 05/14/2008, -2/+31 - The medal is awarded for wounds recived, not bravery
        2 - The contention is to award the medal to those who suffered psychological damage as a result of combat, not for the fact that they couldn't "hack it"
    • ElAssoWipo, on 05/14/2008, -3/+5http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96AW-435J8E

      In WW2 PTSD didn't exist. Doesn't mean they didn't get it anyway.
      • unreg, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1Correct. PTSD certainly exists in any combat vet (or that that matter anyone whose suffered through a traumatic event). I watched my father-in-law deal with the issue as a result of his combat activity during the Battle of the Bulge.
    • jfarabaugh, on 05/14/2008, -8/+34You’re a Douche bag!!

      Since my wife is a doctor on a PTSD unit at a VA hospital I can tell you how bad PTSD can mess up a persons life….little things like going to a barbecue can cause a mental breakdown since the smell of cooking meat reminds them of their friends bodies burning after a road side IED went off.
      • KhanneaNL, on 05/14/2008, -11/+3What? Jim's crying because we aare roasting marshmellow?
      • mdcarso, on 05/14/2008, -5/+2BBQ is yummy
      • flintmecha, on 05/14/2008, -1/+4DELICIOUS
      • JustinNoland, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2OM NOM NOM NOM
      • gryphon50, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1it's interesting the strange things that can make a PSTD sufferer relive the moment...I read once that some Titanic survivors relived their horrific memories when they heard the cheering at baseball games because it reminded them of all the people screaming in the water. That must be terrible, to not know what is going to give you flashbacks every day.
    • exomni, on 05/14/2008, -9/+26***** you and everyone who's digging you up.
      • ElAssoWipo, on 05/14/2008, -1/+14They support the troops, but only the ones that are in movies.
    • ellabee, on 05/14/2008, -3/+11That was ***** heartless and narrow-minded. Hope you stay in Happy-Land for the rest of your life.
    • Stettenbauer, on 05/14/2008, -2/+1Wars are not as black and white as they where since world war 2.Stop watching all those John Wayne movies.
    • lhbaker, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1For someone who doesn't comment much, you really dropped a deuce there.
    • IdevInull, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1I think what a lot of people miss here is that when you get out of the service you are given more points for certain things like purple hearts when applying for government jobs. I don't think we want more crazy people in government than we already have.
      • USMC21Yrs, on 05/17/2008, -0/+0Yeah I got 5 points for my military service, and another 5 points for being 80%disabled vet. Part of which liver lips was PTSD. 10% whole for PTSD, wow, and I did do federal service so hopefully I screwed you somehow for having such a pea brain. You'd be surprised at the quality vets that suffer from PTSD. I, and most don't want purple hearts, but cringe at all the behind your back laughs at your expense if they find out. For serving my country through 3 different conflicts, to serve you funny one. I'm 51 years old and take 18 different medications a day. Some the VA can provide, many they don't, seem fair to you?? So before you go making crazy jokes think of those who served first. Chances are you never did!!
    • USMC21Yrs, on 05/17/2008, -0/+0You'd be surprised at the number, and type of vets that come home with PTSD, it is not something we are proud of, but should not be made fun of either. I neither seek nor want a purple heart that goes to the guys that get torn up physically and should never change. But don't make fun of someone until you've walked a mile in his combat boots.
  • fleischner, on 05/14/2008, -22/+13I'm sure John Kerry would have self-requested a few of those too if they were available during back then.
    • JoeVet, on 05/14/2008, -4/+15At least he did his duty unlike you GOP chickenhawks.
      • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -1/+4Im doing my duty and I think it's a stupid idea.
    • jezsik, on 05/14/2008, -4/+13Well, in that case, I suppose ol' Bushie will want to create a pre-traumatic stress medal for those who bravely avoided traumatic stress by ducking out of action completely.
      • VinceNoir, on 05/14/2008, -4/+1Preemptive strike! Preemptive strike! ***** idiot man. He doesn't deserve to be in the Whitehouse. He didn't get my vote either time. Worthless piece of *****.
  • removesstains, on 05/14/2008, -17/+31This is lame. So that means the purple heart will lose its meaning. Another slap in the face to people that got physically wounded in war.
    • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -8/+14The purple heart never had much meaning, for every combat wounded veteran, there was some idiot who broke his ankle ***** around in a combat area, or shot himself in the foot that gets one as well.
      • DteK, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Back on Ft Hood I almost blew my face off ***** around with rigging a deer stand up with about 20 Hoffman devices. I was at least a mile away from the company AA but they still heard the explosion I was told. Was blind for about 12 hours and could not hear for about a day. Almost got an article 15 but ended up with restriction and extra duty. Not a combat situation(actually while training to go to Bosnia) but this type of ***** must happen everyday in Iraq I imagine. Just dumb ***** soldiers do to pass the time that hopefully you will get to look back on and laugh at
    • frostbyt, on 05/14/2008, -3/+2I guess we have to stop going to war of silly things.
    • lhbaker, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2The Purple Heart lost its meaning when the GOP distributed Purple Heart Band-Aids at the Republican National Convention.
      http://tinyurl.com/6bd24
  • NailerNforce, on 05/14/2008, -3/+18"I got my psyche ***** up and all I got was this lousy medal."
  • coffeebot, on 05/14/2008, -4/+39Shouldn't they receive the Purple Brain?
  • AntBing, on 05/14/2008, -4/+9A wound is a wound wether physical or mental. I don't really agree with expanding the criteria for a Purple Heart, but some other recognition would be a great idea.
    • HarryBauzonia, on 05/14/2008, -9/+5How about a free six-month supply of tampons?
      • VinceNoir, on 05/14/2008, -4/+7How about you shut the ***** up you ungrateful piece of *****? Have a little respect you coward.
        • DarkReign16, on 05/20/2008, -0/+1Wow, VinceNoir is a fascist. I've been reading his comment section, and he literally fills in the blanks to the definition of fascism on wikipedia, dictionary, and other sites.

          Scary....
    • FlagrantDrugUse, on 05/14/2008, -1/+7While I agree with you about not expanding the criteria of the Purple Heart, I don't agree that they should receive "recognition" (in the form of a medal or award or something like that) for mental wounds. Rather, they should receive counseling and treatment. I'm not trying to downplay the severity of PTSD, it's indeed just as traumatic if not more so than being grievously injured, but to me it seems like more of a thing that needs to be treated by doctors and counselors, not something you get a brain-shaped medal for. If it were me in that situation, I don't think I would want a medal signifying the mental illness I am trying to recover from.
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3You are more likely to make a soldier worse by rewarding their PTSD more then anything else.
  • Asvetic, on 05/14/2008, -8/+6Do Purple Hearts cure Psychological Wounds?
    • maldovix, on 05/14/2008, -0/+6do they cure physical ones either?
    • WTFppl, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1Just for politicians! O'wait, that's a cold heart...sorry!
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1No they make them worse
  • levelred, on 05/14/2008, -8/+13No!
    This is horrible, next thing you know they will be given out Purple Hearts to soldiers that have fell out of trucks, and toe fungus. Seriously PTSD is real! But to give out purple hearts to people that are suffering from it is another thing.
    • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -2/+9"next thing you know they will be given out Purple Hearts to soldiers that have fell out of trucks"

      They already do.
      • erasedgod, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3Really? Let's see a citation for one?
        • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2What am I, you're professor, look it up yourself. Any injury in a combat zone is eligible for a purple heart, If you hit a bump and fall off your vehicle in "combat" you are eligible. Trust me, I've seen morons do stupider things and get them when I was in Afghanistan.
          • erasedgod, on 05/15/2008, -1/+2No, you're a douche on the internet making claims without evidence. You're absolutely wrong about any injury being eligible as well. If you're a part of some *****-bag command that will bend the rules and lie on a citation, that's one thing, but it doesn't reflect on the military as a whole.
    • yunus, on 05/14/2008, -0/+6I would not be offended if it was given out to people truly suffering from it but this would open a flood gate of medals handed out and degrade the medal to just something that is given out for going to the shrink. I know at least 1 people who faked PTSD to get out of work, this was while I was Active duty Air Force.
      • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Yeah, that's my only issue with giving them this medal. It won't degrade it, because of the jackass things so many guys and gals do to get it anyway, but there will be a flood of people running to mental health to claim issues. And where do they draw the line? You know some jerk will come in saying he's stressed from his tour in Japan, then Germany, then Hawaii...

        I once saw a fellow Marine get a "no shave" waiver for a freaking month because he cut himself shaving...? You can talk these navy medical folks into ANYTHING.
        • yunus, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2The Air Force maybe DOD wide gave the GWOT (Global War on Terrorism) service to everyone who was not in basic training on a given date. It is supposed to be given to those who supported Operation Noble Eagle and the war in Afghanistan at the time but the Air Force decided that because I was stationed in Las Vegas and our Aircraft (not me at the time) supported the mission that I deserved the medal to. You know what that medal now means. That you were in the military on a given date not that you actually deployed or even supported deployed people.
          • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1Yep, that was DoD wide, everybody in the Marine Corps got that ribbon if they were out of bootcamp. The Marine Corps has always been pretty tough on handing out ribbons and medals, to help uphold their meaning, and even they gave that one out.
    • VinceNoir, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Hey at least Rush Limbaugh would argue he deserves one for the boil on his ass that he used as an excuse to keep his cowardly fat carcass out of Vietnam!
  • Albumen, on 05/14/2008, -10/+9Quick! Get a sensor over Patton's grave... I'll bet we can detect his remians rolling over!
    • LonesomeFighter, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1with todays education on the subject he won't care. But he will slap you with his glove.
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1He's probably trying to digg out to slap the ***** out of the jack ass that thought of this
  • pershingdriver, on 05/14/2008, -1/+24Instead of a medal how about we live up to our responsibility as a nation to our combat veterans and get them the care they need to live full lives. As a nation we should hang our heads in shame for continuing to allow the VA hospital system to treat our veterns this way.
    • HarryBauzonia, on 05/14/2008, -5/+11That's the same healthcare system we'll all have if the socialists get their way.
      • VinceNoir, on 05/14/2008, -8/+2You really are a worthless piece of *****, aren't you?
      • willskillz, on 05/14/2008, -2/+4interesting point.
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1They won't do that because it would mean that service men and women would get rewarded with something they could use and that would be bad
    • pintomp3, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2you are talking about increasing socialized medicine, you commie! clearly a shiny piece of medal is all they deserve.
  • OffPiste, on 05/14/2008, -7/+9So the Fobbit that gets to go to BK or Subway every day for lunch but pees his pants when he gets within a 100 meters of the wire gets the same Purple Heart the same as the grunt who gets wounded in a firefight trying to save his buddy. Nice!
  • compdude32, on 05/14/2008, -10/+10Not to sound cold hearted, but why does a Psch case need a medal at all? The Purple Heart was intended for people who were wounded while defending the country. It has already been twisted to include people who were injured while in the military regardless of the situation, lets not tarnish it more.

    Cracking under the stress of battle is no case to be rewarded, taking a bullet during a fire fight with the enemy is.
    • TheSavant, on 05/14/2008, -1/+13Rest assured I did not crack under the strain of battle. That is not how PTSD works. I'm not asking for a medal. I have enough. I would like people to know more about PTSD. The ***** is for real. Your post, and many others like it, are good examples of why we get treated like ***** by our peers and the general public. PTSD doesn't come from a "weak" mind. Your odds of getting it are the same as mine. Well, except for the combat thing. That ups the odds a little.
      • compdude32, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2I am not denying it is real, I know it is real my father suffered from it after Vietnam. I am just saying it isn't something you should get a medal over.
      • IdevInull, on 05/14/2008, -5/+2PTSD comes from being a pussy -- really mostly the military's fault because pussies like you should have never made it through boot.
    • spaceddaisy, on 05/14/2008, -0/+9PTSD is not cracking under the stress of battle, PTSD and many of the other psychological problems they are dealing with come AFTER the battles, after trying to fit in 'at home' again, dealing with memories of seeing your buddies die, of trying to save someone, but being just too late.

      Thanks TheSavant for your service and I hope picking up your life again is going well for you. I know from second hand what it's like, trying to get my man back on his feet and living life again after two tours in Iraq.
      • TheSavant, on 05/14/2008, -0/+6Actually yes, things are picking up. I had a rough few years, but things are getting better. Thanks for saying something! I hope your troop is getting the hang of things again.
        • spaceddaisy, on 05/15/2008, -0/+3Glad things are going better for you.

          And thank you too, he's slowly but surely getting to his feet.
    • Pimptastic, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1I can say it is defiantly not given for any type of injury regardless of the situation. I wound up getting injured on duty to the point I wasnt able to continue my service. No medal here for that injury, nor do I want one.
  • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -3/+19As someone who has served honorably for the Marine Corps in Afghanistan, I can tell you that, at least most Marines, don't look too kindly on purple hearts anyway, so let these fellas have them.

    The idea of the purple heart is good, but for every Marine or Soldier injured by an enemy grenade, there are two who fell down and broke their ankle, or shot themselves in the foot that get one as well.

    They really only mean something to civilians.
    • OffPiste, on 05/14/2008, -1/+7Purple heart. AKA the enemy marksmanship medal.
    • SgtBulldog, on 05/14/2008, -0/+6Semper Fi, fellow devil dog. I served in Iraq and certainly agree. There are some people who were truly injured by enemy fire, but many who receve Purple Hearts have done so by just doing something stupid like picking up and throwing around unexploded ordnance.
      • KevinRWright, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1Oh you knew one of those idiots too? Ugh, it's that 10% that'll do your head in, i'm tellin' ya.
  • jasdf, on 05/14/2008, -4/+9This is a horrible thing to do. This will greatly diminish the significance of the Purple Heart just like the significance of the Air Medal has been diminished. Back in WWII thousands died before they could fly 20 combat missions to receive an Air Medal and here I am with 6 air medals and I have never been shot at once. It really is a shame that our highest military decorations have been diluted so much.
  • johnomaz, on 05/14/2008, -17/+7Here mister pussy ass bitch boy, heres your purple heart because you got scared and it gives you nightmares.
    What do the soldiers that get both injured and have psychological problems get? A purple heart and a gold star? Thats pretty much what they made the purple heart into, a little sticker to make someone feel happy.
    • coffeebot, on 05/14/2008, -0/+7i got a sticker when i voted!
      • vibrokatana, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3I got a sticker that said "My Vote Counted", when in fact it didn't. Demockracy in action.
    • socalmarine0311, on 05/14/2008, -0/+6"Here mister pussy ass bitch boy, heres your purple heart because you got scared and it gives you nightmares"

      If you're calling us pussies, you have no idea what it's like.
    • ogloom, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1is someone angry that their job at wendy's isn't as fulfilling as a job in the army =[
    • asspants, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Johnomaz, you're not allowed to call them pussy ass bitch boys unless you're done with toilet training.
      If you have made it through a combat zone (counter strike doesnt count, *****) then by all means go ahead, but untill then shut the ***** up.
    • lhbaker, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3Please join the Army immeidately. Your life needs to be sacrificed.
      • Chrontius, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1Thank you, Mr. Baker. Johnny up there is such a douche your otherwise impressively rude comment made me LOL.
  • xsecretfiles, on 05/14/2008, -6/+1....so we can easily identify them between the civilian population and stay far away from them...... good I gues.....
  • pookkake, on 05/14/2008, -10/+9Why not create an Emo medal
  • louiebaur, on 05/14/2008, -3/+3Thats a good idea
  • xodex, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3Huff Puff.... Squeak Squeak. I congratulate you with a purple heart.

    TIMMEH!? :D
  • jezsik, on 05/14/2008, -0/+16Instead of giving them bowling trophies, maybe we could, oh, I dunno, TAKE CARE OF THEM instead?
  • OffPiste, on 05/14/2008, -3/+2Cowards like that Pogoni dude who claimed he was SF do NOT deserve a Purple Heart.
  • HarryBauzonia, on 05/14/2008, -2/+15Great.
    The Army made black berets mean nothing by giving them to everyone, and now they want to purple heart to either mean nothing or taint it with the stigma of mental illness.

    We need tighter requirements for awarding medals, not looser ones. And while I'm on the subject, how about we stop automatically labeling as heroes people who are paid to do certain jobs. That term has no meaning at all anymore because of its over-use. I'm a vet, so I know all too well that wearing a uniform doesn't change your personality or make you an instant hero. Heroes jump on live grenades or throw themselves into a sea-state 4 ocean to save drowning kids.

    Reporting to work in a clean uniform at the supply office at 8 every morning is not heroic. Writing speeding tickets or putting out a fire at a hardware store isn't heroic either.....but I digress.

    Opening up the standards for receiving a purple heart is stupid. Chest candy is supposed to mean something, but the desk-sitters think it's supposed to make your uniform look pretty..
    • vermax, on 05/14/2008, -3/+2"stigma" of mental illness? how about we make a special medal for strutting macho *****, then you could have your chest covered with candy
      • HarryBauzonia, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Yes, stigma.
        Apparently you're one of the few who are proud to be mentally deficient.

        Nice rant, by the way. I've never thought of ***** in masculine terms before. You must have an interesting wardrobe.
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3Yeah On my last tour in Iraq we received the requirements for awards before we left it was set by rank and position not by who did what. I HQ officer and Senior NCO got bronze stars and everyone else got ARCOMs or AARs not matter what they did.
  • BohicaTwentyTwo, on 05/14/2008, -1/+14PTSD is a serious problem that has been around as long as warfare, but that doesn't mean we should hand out medals for it. If a soldier is injured or killed in a non-combat related accident, he doesn't get a medal. I do not think this would have the effect they intend.

    Life is unfair sometimes. Military life doubly so. Embrace the suck.
    • mahler, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2I think the way they intended it, was to recognize the sacrifice that they made. If a military psychologist or psychiatrist (a specialist!) decides that the PTSD is truly severe and there would be a risk in sending the soldier back to the frontlines, we should recognize this and award the purple heart.
      • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3If its that serious then he should get help not medals
        • mahler, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1I agree that help is needed, but giving a medal is part of that help
  • noseeme, on 05/14/2008, -2/+6I thought Army policy was to just call them yellow-bellied pansies, and send them to a psych hospital to rot in.
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2You know ***** about the Army then.
    • Chrontius, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1I'm not digging you up or down because I'm not sure if you're bitter, or just being an *****. Please clarify?
  • JoeVet, on 05/14/2008, -5/+9We learned in WWI that mental disorders induced by battle is best treated by not treating it as a disease but by forcing the afflicted back to reality by returning him to the front lines as quickly as possible. By giving a medal to these same soldiers would simply cement in their minds that they are mentally disabled and result in a longer more difficult recovery. The best treatment is the same as in all wars, allow a rest period and then get them back into the game of life. Don't encourage the self doubt by rewarding it with a medal.
    • socalmarine0311, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3I agree with not giving PTSD vets a medal, but "forcing the afflicted back ... to the front lines" isn't really a good idea. I've seen people freeze in combat, in situations where they could have gotten others killed. It IS an injury, and as such, they shouldn't be fighting.
      • IdevInull, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2If you 'freeze' in combat you should be shot for not following orders.
        • Chrontius, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1Can you blame someone who is - to be blunt - broken? Perhaps just a little, but that's all it takes to cause the sort of hesitation Socal is talking about.
    • lhbaker, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Every other argument against has been moronic, but yours actually makes good sense. Having PTSD is a horrible thing, but it can often be treated successfully, even without drugs. The same cannot be said for physical scars.
  • exomni, on 05/14/2008, -1/+16How about we actually give them decent ***** medical treatment first.
  • socalmarine0311, on 05/14/2008, -1/+9I've been diagnosed with PTSD and I would feel horrible if they gave me a purple heart for it. That's *****. Mental problems are not the same thing as being hit by an IED or small arms fire. They need to keep the regs the way they are, or make them tighter. Just like when my unit started handing out Navy and Marine Corps Achievement Medals like candy...they stopped meaning anything. It was just like, "Oh, you have a NAM, too? Cool, 17 of my friends have those."
  • tufftugg, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3 If that's the case, shouldn't all Americans get one? Having chose the Administration they have had for the last 7 years, surely something is bent upstairs
  • taradisiac, on 05/14/2008, -6/+3By giving those medals to the crazies you're making them worthless. Would the hobo down the street get one if he enlists?
    • lhbaker, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1I wish I had a script that would bury everything you say automatically.
  • darkheritage, on 05/14/2008, -3/+4General Patton is rolling over in his grave. He would just slap them all and send the yellowbellies to the front lines. So someone who has both his legs blown off and has to deal with the stress of that the rest of his life, plus the stress of the war receives the same medal as someone who had a mental breakdown...
    • frostbyt, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1Until they go crazy and wipe out an entire mall with an AK47 for not having their favorite flavor of ice-cream in stock.
    • vermax, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1sorry you ever had to leave the military. with such a crisp black and white world view, you'd be very handy, just tell you where to go waste your life on some meaningless bullet and off you march.
  • insanebrain, on 05/14/2008, -2/+1- ". . With Psychol"
    What ?? Next time post a ***** decent title.
  • duggtodeath, on 05/14/2008, -3/+6Emo Medals? In all seriousness, psychological trauma can't be erased by a stupid medal. These men sacrificed their bodies and minds for doing what they thought wad the right thing. These men needs help, not shiny awards.
  • HarryBauzonia, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1I think this is just a scheme to get free license plates.
  • orophin, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4let women join comabat units and politicians wouldn't be so quick to put troops in places where they earn medals. Joe Congress can get away with saying your son died for the cause here's your flag and medal. Saying we're real sorry your daughter is mutilated beyond recognition and has no legs strikes a very different message with voters
    • ZenMojo, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1True. Kind of like, if they actually started sentencing women to the death penalty, the death penalty would disappear quick.
  • sfacets, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4So do these medals hold any value any more under the current leadership?
    • drmobutu, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2This is a symbolic gesture, designed to let the perpetrators wash their hands of the whole affair...we gave you a medal, see? Your sacrifice and suffering wasn't for nothing....
  • jayrok, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3With the number of purple hearts they'll have to manufacture, I'm sure they'll say "Made in China" on the back.
  • uziko, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1that would be a disgrace to gun shot wound purple heart owners everywhere
  • jessehadden, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4I am for this, but I have a better idea... end the war, and bring those poor bastards home. "Like the rat said, 'Keep the cheese -- I just want out of the maze.'"
  • gdha, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Why wouldn't they?? They still had to suffer from some kind of battle, their anatomy was still effected just not physically. Hopefully they mean real disorders not the 'Oh I can't think straight now when I'm golfing, give me a purple heart' crap.
  • flintmecha, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2PTSD is easier to fake than an IED wound.
  • pennvneff, on 05/14/2008, -0/+8You can take that purple heart and shove it up Dubya's ass.

    You want to do right for our brothers and sisters who risk everything to fight for Iraqi freedom? Get them the kind of tools that make a difference, things like armor for the troops. Don't send our bravest and the best into do a job unequipped.

    And make sure they get all the proper treatment once they get back home. There are way too many of them coming back with PTSD that goes unchecked which is leading to way too damn many suicides. And how about make sure that our vets get all the proper medical treatment for their wounds too? Our VA hospitals are a joke and it's really embarrassing how ***** we treat our soldiers after they come back.

    Also McCain how about signing off on that new GI bill?

    They deserve better.

    • ReverendRodger, on 05/14/2008, -0/+5You're absolutely right. My brother-in-law who has done several tours of Afghanistan and Iraq had to take out a loan to buy his own body armor ($5000 I think). That in itself is ridiculous.

      My friend that lives with me (gave him a place to live and helped him reintegrate after he got back from war) was awarded two purple hearts - one for nearly getting his arm blown off and the other for taking a .50 cal bullet to the chest after it went through his bud's skull - gets treated like ***** by the gov. He had to pay back his signing bonus because his combat wounds got him an early honorable discharge.

      The way this government treats its active duty military and its vets is ridiculous and insulting.
      • Pimptastic, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2They made him pay back his bonus? That is wrong. I get an honorable discharge after a major injury in a shipyard and I didnt have to pay back anything. If you are involuntarily separated you arent supposed to repay anything since they are breaking the contract.
        • ReverendRodger, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1I have a feeling he got some bad info. He wanted to finish his 10 year contract so he transferred to the Guard. I know he definitely had to pay back his bonus because he was suppose to get back some money on this taxes this year and was pleasantly surprised when the Department of the Treasury had deducted pretty much all of it to get the bonus back.
      • IdevInull, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2B.S. on several counts here....
        If he paid $5000 for body armor then he is an idiot -- plus I am sure he was issued armor he just wanted different armor.
        A .50 cal going would not even notice a head...or his chest. If it was .50 cal your friend would be dead.
        • Chrontius, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1there's more to half-inch bullets than .50BMG, you know.

          I hope you know.

          Well, you know now.

          The Interceptor armor has some known flaws that I'd call fatal flaws, if not for the extremely bad word choice. Based on what I've read, they'll stop a bullet fine, but only one. They're heavy, and they break if dropped, even if while attached to a soldier trying to get cover. This is a *VERY BAD* time to have your armor break.
  • rocketpop, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2I don't think so--in this case, a medal is just inappropriate. "We're going to honor you because you saw some really bad things happen and it really messed you up in the head." For the most part, everyone sees bad things happen, but it effects some people greater than others. 10 people see the same thing happen, 2 of them crack and get metals, while those that cope with it get nothing.
    Getting physically wounded in battle is sort of an honorable thing. This would take away the meaning of that. Getting mentally traumatized is not really the same thing--it can certainly be terrible, and I'm sure in some cases worse than some of the things that purple hearts have been given out for, but it just doesn't make sense to get the same metal for it. How about getting this people therapy instead.
  • Brownds, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2How about we take all the purple hearts and shove them up the GOPs ass? Then use the Iraq war funding to finance our wounded vets for the rest of their lives? After what our vets have gone through for us I would say that's a start.
  • AlwaysAwake, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3Absolutely essential recognition, long overdue. Just because the wounds don't show on the outside, doesn't mean these men haven't suffered as much or more than those with wounds that show. And their friends and families too. PTSD is a devastating illness, still largely a mystery to those treating it at the VA, and elsewhere. The whole circle of people around a sufferer is damaged by this illness, and suicide, and/or homicide is not uncommon, left untreated.
  • aaronbrannt, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3They should give them a Blue Heart. pun intended
  • drmobutu, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2What purpose would giving a soldier a medal for psychological injuries serve? Seems to me, most military types would consider that to be something to be ashamed of, rather than proud...it would be far, far better to actually provide the guys with quality medical/psychological/GI Bill benefits, than to give them a trinket, symbolic of their psychological devastation. This seems to me to be another cheap attempt by the GOP to gloss over the horrendous damage that they have inflicted on so many in our armed services.
  • frostbyt, on 05/14/2008, -4/+6Don't join the military and you...

    -Won't get killed
    -Won't get shot at, IEDs blown up around you
    -Won't be asked to kill another human being for reasons unknown to you
    -Won't have to suffer when you get home
    -Won't have a hard time finding a job

    But if you like those things go be all you can be.
    • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -3/+3You have never been to a major city have you? Most of those things could happen to you while walking home from the store. Or if your in a field that could be taken over by illegals because they don't require as much money for doing it. As for the IEDs if people didn't join the Military we would have that problem in this country. You inbred Moron
      • frostbyt, on 05/14/2008, -3/+3How would htey get over here? They don't even have enough money to buy a ticket.
        • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -2/+7You really don't know anything do you? The terrorists that would blow us up have access to lots of money.
          • frostbyt, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2You must live in constant media driven fear of being attacked. Its going to be ok no one is out to get you.
          • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Since I am a soldier there alot of people out to get me when I deploy. And when I'm home there are morons like you who say "Come on in don't worry we won't fight back when you try to kill us". You and the people who believe like you do are what got us into this mess in the first place. You believe if we say we're sorry and leave that we will be left alone. But we won't it will just make them believe they are on the right track until they are at your door telling you what to say and what to think. No more freedom. Just burkas and man dresses as far as the eye can see.


            Oh Frost, just so you know that last sentence was a joke if you don't know what that means try looking in a dictionary. If you know what one looks like
          • bbqsalad, on 05/14/2008, -2/+1You are the exact problem with America DavidS9. People like you who live in constant fear of everything. If you really are a soldier that is really sad because you have truly been brainwashed.
          • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3Yeah I know its sad that I go off what I see and experience rather then be spoon fed propaganda by cowards and idiots. The only fear I have is that people like you will get into power and surrender this country to its enemies
          • bbqsalad, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1No, Our only enemy at this point is people like you destroying this country and any future we might have. I suppose we will never agree with each other. I just hope when we finish killing everyone who might have money, guns or oil our planet is still habitable. Enjoy living in fear!
    • bbqsalad, on 05/14/2008, -2/+4Chances are real good if your joining the military your going to be fighting in Iraq. Why would you want to do that? What are you protecting? Not the Americans, not the Iraqi's.. You are protecting the rich while making sure our children spend there lives in debt for it. I believe we need some security obviously but the current war we are fighting is without reason.
      • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4There is a reason it's different from the one we went over there for but there is a very good reason and its not oil
        • bbqsalad, on 05/14/2008, -2/+1and that is? Greed? Revenge? What is a good reason to waste so many lives? please elaborate.
        • bbqsalad, on 05/14/2008, -2/+1My guess is you don't know. I bet the military tells you the same things. You seem to have no idea about reality or have the capacity to even question yourself.
        • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -1/+5I would but by reading your previous posts I have come to the conclusion that what ever I say you would find fault and call me some kind of brainwashed robot.

          And do you know me at all?? or are you just jumping to a stupid conclusions based off afew sentences.
          • bbqsalad, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Because you cant even give a reason to be killing innocent people. You say they will "get us". Iraq? Saddam was going to take over the USA? Somehow you think being over there killing children and anyone who doesn't help you will somehow make them not want to kill us? You make a post saying

            "There is a reason it's different from the one we went over there for but there is a very good reason and its not oil"

            WTF is that? You dont know do you? How come nobody knows this reason? Interesting. You are a brainwashed robot. And a ignorant fool also. Is it such a hard question to answer? WHY ARE WE IN IRAQ FIGHTING A WAR THAT THOUSANDS HAVE DIED FOR?
          • DavidS9, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2You choose not to see reason. You ignorance is proven by what you write. WE are not over there killing innocent people on purpose sometimes innocent people get caught in the cross fire but its war and that happens. We are over there now fighting against and people who would love to come over and kill us. It is a battlefield in a much larger war that people like you just don't want to see. I would rather the fighting take place in Iraq than in California or Florida.

            When I say "they will TRY and get us" I'm talking about terrorists the idiots that would rather blow themselves and a hundred innocent people up then face some one on a battle flied. But you refuse to see that you are blinded by your own fear that people that choose to defend this country are just war mongering and would look for any excuse to kill people. Its not true the people who want peace the most are the ones who chose to live and die for their country. The defend the walls so you don't have to.
          • bbqsalad, on 05/15/2008, -2/+2Then how come every person I know who has been fighting in Iraq is told to kill anyone who does not help stop the terrorists. Why would there be people suicide bombing all the time? Simply because we are rich and they are poor possibly? They hate our freedoms? No. They hate you being there. They hate the fact you have killed there brother and sisters when they were not the ones flying the planes into the towers. They hate you destroying there homes and only making things worse for them. WE ARE NOT THE WORLD POLICE. What right do we have doing this? What we have is a bunch of kids who barley can support them selfs in life, being shipped overseas and given weapons and told to kill people.

            I have tried incredibly hard to understand this mess. I have listened very carefully to the president, I have seen the news, read the paper. I live right next to NYC and 9/11 hit VERY close to home for me. I want NOTHING more than to have this country be a safe and free place where people can live together peacefully without worry of things blowing up on a regular basis. I can respect the fact people join the military to serve there country and protect us from harm. I am greatfull for this. But after all of this, trying incredibly hard to understand that somehow this war in IRAQ is helping things. And I just don't see it. You have failed to give me any actual explanation for us being there other than "they might get us at home again". We have the richest country in the world, Incredible weapons and technology. 9/11 was allowed to happen and this is quite ***** obvious to anybody with a brain. There are so many facts proving this. The amount of blood that has been shed there is just enough already. Are we going to kill everyone?! That seems like what you are saying needs to be done to be safe? Like bush said, Your either with us, or against us.
      • twitchr, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1I was with ya till the end when you said that our government let 9/11 happen. get a clue truthie.
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