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Apple Leopard ready to pounce

itwire.com.au — Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer has promised Windows users that there will never be another five year delay between operating systems. However, with Apple's new Mac OS X version Leopard looming, the damage may well already be irreparable.

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  • Chex, on 10/12/2007, -214/+19Dream on... Mac is nothing but eye-candy for newbs.
    • procdaddy, on 10/12/2007, -16/+80yeah and where is Final Cut Pro for Windows? I'm far from a Apple fanboy, but I see pluses and minuses of both. Be a bit more open minded, n00b.
    • CiXeL, on 10/12/2007, -146/+13yeah exactly 1 app. most people dont need video editing you know
    • procdaddy, on 10/12/2007, -10/+47there is more than one app that makes Macs very appealing, but thats one MAJOR app that is very popular.
    • gcnaddict, on 10/12/2007, -26/+39"the damage may well already be irreparable."

      What damage?
    • AppleIsGay, on 10/12/2007, -63/+19Adobe Premiere is a good alternative for professional video editing on Windows. There is also the expensive Avid Xpress.
    • liquidrums, on 10/12/2007, -9/+19http://www.duggmirror.com/apple/Apple_Leopard_ready_to_pounce/

      @ Bloekle: The mirror needs be closer to the top.
    • procdaddy, on 10/12/2007, -14/+40that is like using MS Paint as an alternative to Photoshop...
    • Drgn547, on 10/12/2007, -6/+51I run Windows, OSX, and Linux boxes, all of them suiting their own unique purpose. Calling OSX Users noobz isn't going to fix your technological inadequacies, Chex. Oh, and next time you write an OS that's better than OSX, let everyone know.
    • zodieman, on 10/12/2007, -7/+19I guess Macs are not allowed to have exclusive apps for them?
      Now you know how it feels to be a Mac user at times when we can't get certain Windows apps. At least we can now run Windows when we need to for that occasional program now.
    • thespace, on 10/12/2007, -39/+9How about .... it just works and works for you. Newbie or not, I'm not going to sit there for hours trying to get my FRICKIN WIRELESS NETWORK TO PLAY NICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't really care how much eye candy you throw in, make .... the.... damn.... thing.... work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      And it is beautiful it finds the network for me and always automatically connects in to my usual networks. If I'm at a hotel or something, it will find the wireless network for me. Perrrrfecto!!
    • iwbwemf, on 10/12/2007, -40/+12I love seeing all of the Macaphobes comments. Cracks me up. Let Gates's ***** out of your mouth for more than three seconds so you can see what os x has to offer.
    • vanadaar, on 10/12/2007, -9/+34Spoken like someone who has never used a Mac.
    • shasty55, on 10/12/2007, -10/+7how about linux? almost all the software for that is free, but it is definitely not for "newbs"
    • PJBonoVox, on 10/12/2007, -26/+24"yeah and where is Final Cut Pro for Windows?"

      Funny this. Windows has a range of software that completely blows away the OSX library, yet you mention this one piece of software.

      But when Windows users don't want to switch because they can't run [insert app here] they get flamed off the park.
    • IQ70, on 10/12/2007, -21/+6So Apple is making everyone pay for another upgrade?
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -6/+17@PJBonoVox:

      Ok, where is Aperture for Windows? Lightroom, the closest thing, does have have nearly the featureset and is still only in beta. That's just one more example, but there are others.

      You are living in the past, the Mac has more than closed the software gap in just about any area you care to name - the only category left where it's definatley far behind is games.

      But all of that is irrelevant since with the move to Intel, I can run any Windows app I like in Parallels and run any PC game using Bootcamp. Meanwhile I also get the category kilkler applications that only the Mac has.

      How is being able to run both Mac and Windows apps ever going to be worse than just being able to run Windows apps?
    • count_z, on 10/12/2007, -5/+10What damage? People aren't going to switch (which implies buying a new machine and buying new software and potentially losing some apps because they aren't supported) just because Vista is late.

      Most people don't care all that much about the OS... they care more about their programs.

      People will be more likely to switch because of the hardware (the machines are very nice... particularly their laptops) and only because of the OS.
    • JayClark, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12Forcing us to upgrade? No, they're not making anyone do anything. I know people who still run Panther and are perfectly happy with it. On a similar note, those of us who do upgrade will do so because we get a lot of value for our money.

      If you don't see that value, there's a really simple way to not waste your own money here: Don't buy it yourself.

      As for the comment about the Windows library being bigger, that's true. I have found, though, that the Mac software library has a higher concentration of good and affordable titles, so that I don't miss the extra options. Given thew choice between having 100 titles to choose from, 10 of which are real contenders, or 40 titles to choose from, 10 of which are contenders, what good do those extra 60 titles do you?

      In the end though, it comes down to personal choice. How sad a human being are you if you feel the need to rag on people who choose to use a different OS that you? How empty must your own life be to expend this kind of energy trying to convince people that your opinions are correct?
    • shmatt, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6it's an optional upgrade
      by that logic vista should be free too.
    • ucbrave92, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7i can't wait for leopard, and I am a recent switcher myself. i still run 2 windows boxes but they are only for games and my pvr. all of my real work is done on my mac, and as for the newb comment i am far from it, i work as an it consultant. my reason for buying a mac was that i have to put up with so much of a headache at work fixing windows boxes all day that i didn't want to deal with a crappy os when i came home and had limited time to get work done. if not for the pure stability alone, i love os x, not to mention that all of the apps are great and even most of the freeware/shareware available is written much better than the majority of the apps you can run on windows.
    • simong, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6Hehe, yes macosx has some nice eyecandy. But beneath the eyecandy there is a nice fresh unix base. If you only have seen the eyecandy you can't judge macosx.

      On the otherhand, how are you going to survive when vista is out. Vista is full of eyecandy.
    • ridgelawrence, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4The Good thing about apple is they HAVE a fan base, loyal users that, for the most part, wont leave apple.
      Thats something windows will probably never have.
      Microsoft has to be careful, keeping everything compatible, keeping everything the same.
      Apple can change often because of the leniency of fans and company's, like the new intel line.
      Windows is an OS that people are usually pushed into buying, because of compatibility.
      Thats all changed.
    • soopafly, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7"Dream on... Mac is nothing but eye-candy for newbs."

      Funny thing is Chex, you're going to pay for Vista, which will make your Windoes machine look and run like a Mac.
    • theonlyvlad, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7I'd just like to add my 2 cents...

      Those who said that premiere is to final cut is as MS Paint to Photoshop -- funny joke, but nothing more. FCP has some features in it that go above Premiere's... however, I believe that most people who *really* need those features will edit in an editing house, or on a project where a workstation is provided by them, and that'll usually be a mac.

      However, if you are just a PC owner, mac or windows, and you want to add video capabilities for home movies, or more advanced projects, I do not believe that a PC owner buying Premiere Pro 2.0 will deliver a final product that is worse than a user of FCP 5.

      As far as Aperture... I haven't used it myself, just read about it. From the sounds of its features, I'd say it's comparable to the application I use to manage my photo collection: ACDSee Pro 8.0 ; very powerful software, very fast (well maybe not on bootup, but after that, nothing I could find is faster), has basic editing features and RAW editing galore. Many tagging and cataloging features, etc.

      So please Apple people........ I agree that in a professional editing environment, when doing installations for editing booths with FCP and ProTools, Macs are great, and powerful. But we're talking about users who buy computers for their homes.
    • PJBonoVox, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1@superkendall : "How is being able to run both Mac and Windows apps ever going to be worse than just being able to run Windows apps?"

      The ridiculous monetary outlay outweighs the (minor, for a few people) benefits.
    • macewan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2it's usually a good idea to keep you mouth shut than to open it and remove all doubt that you're a dip
  • Lacero, on 10/12/2007, -16/+43RAWR, can't wait!

    Hasta la vista,Vista.
    • Harboggles, on 10/12/2007, -15/+6Me either, if OS X is any preview, Lep will be amazing!
    • Dakana, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5The release of a new version of an Mac OS is going to do absolutley nothing to Vista.

      Sorry to spoil your incredibly clever ending line.
    • JermWerty, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5Windows OS: 90% market share (aka PCs)
      Apple OS: 3% market share

      There is no threat here at all until Job's lets OSX run on regular PCs. Case and point: Apple just announced a new $2500 dual core Xeon Mac - the problem is you could build the same system youself and run Windows on it for around $900...
    • serenityn, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Hey JermWerty,

      If you can build apple's system for $900 as you claim, I'll buy one from you. Until then, please stop spreading lies.
  • antoniojvr, on 10/12/2007, -27/+12Bury. Sorry.
  • joebob2406, on 10/12/2007, -16/+11I will have to see it to believe it.
  • Tryke, on 10/12/2007, -4/+46Lots of fluff. Summary:

    - Ballmer says "no more 5 year waits"
    - OS X Leopard will come with Boot Camp
    - Bringing home your work is no longer a problem with Intel Macs.
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15You know what is the most important thing? Bringing Macs into work is not as much of a problem either...
    • avsa, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2in the end it's that "oh god, we are soo excited about OSX" kind of article that comes before any keynote. Agreed, windows has visio and tons of games. Mac has quicksilver and some delicious library.

      I just long for those better tomorows when the osx you run or the IM you chat in is not that important anymore...
  • kevinmotel, on 10/12/2007, -7/+17i believe we will see a growth in people owning a mac, but keeping their XP or 2K machines. i for one wish to buy a MBP, as well as build a media center PC with windows MCE
    • CiXeL, on 10/12/2007, -31/+9ill buy a mac when i see a reason to buy an expensive pretty piece of equipment. right now i can only see myself using it to browse the web or so i can act smug about it and i can already browse the web on a cheap pc.

      please mac-philes tell me what the advantages are to using a mac? id really like to hear it. ive never seen anyone give me a decent reason to switch. until i see that im convinced you are fan boys.
    • tdowling, on 10/12/2007, -12/+4"So what you;re saying is that I'mgoing to get taller? Or longer?"

      It will actually be warts, unfortunately.
    • 5555, on 10/12/2007, -8/+23@CiXeL

      Go spend some time with OS X and decide for yourself. Nobody gives a rat's ass if you switch.
    • ZergyPoo, on 10/12/2007, -16/+6"Go spend some time with OS X and decide for yourself. Nobody gives a rat's ass if you switch."

      Actually, many a Mac user does. There is nothing more annoying to me about Macs than the fanatical users who take every possible chance to badmouth anything microsoft, and who try to convince you 24/7 that their system is better.

      There are definitely people who give a rat's ass if we switch, and I wish they would shut the hell up for a change.
    • Drgn547, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7CiXel:
      Everyone uses PCs, Macs, or Linux Distros for different reasons. I prefer OSX (even though I use Windows XP SP2 and SuSE/Ubuntu/RedHat Linux) Just because I'm more comfortable on the system. I'm simply more productive with the OSX GUI. You just have to be willing to learn a new system. I sold a G4 eMac for $800, 2 years after I bought it for $1,100. Try selling a PC for that kind of return after 2 years. If you want to learn more about reasons to switch you can always read: http://www.apple.com/science/whymac/myths.html
    • delvach, on 10/12/2007, -10/+21"please mac-philes tell me what the advantages are to using a mac? id really like to hear it. ive never seen anyone give me a decent reason to switch. until i see that im convinced you are fan boys."

      - Single hardware & software platform eliminates the need for installing drivers and reduces compatibility issues
      - Higher resale value (My Powerbook is 3+ years old and will still sell for $1k)
      - Stability and flexibility of UNIX
      - More secure and stable than Windows
      - Well-researched UI that assumes an intelligent user who doesn't need 200 "Are you sure..." dialog boxes.
      - From the perspective of a cross-browser/platform web developer, IE is the worst browser on the market, and people using it make my life difficult.

      Don't get me wrong, if you're just using your computer for checking mail and reading news, Windows is fine, especially if you have a good warranty, know someone proficient in troubleshooting, and/or don't mind re-installing when things get hosed.

      Without being a smartass, my experience is to treat Windows like a virus and keep it contained, which is why Parallels is such a great solution for me. I can start up XP or 2K when I need, address issues arising from IE bugs, and keep it suspended the rest of the time. When I run Windows update and it gets completely screwed up, I just copy a cloned disk image and go from my last stable installation.

      That said, I used to hate Macs before I used one, too. :)
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6Why would you buy a Mac and keep your XP computer when you can just install and run XP on the Mac as well - especially with Parrallels.

      Or, possibly you keep the XP computer around but it simply falls into disuse once the data is moved off - I have heard that same pattern many time from people buying Macs, and it was also true for myself. I kept my WIndows desktop up for a while but I was never using it.
    • knupso, on 10/12/2007, -8/+7Mac hardware is just way over priced for what you get. You can build a PC put Linux, Windows, BSD or what ever OS you so desire, that can do anything that a mac can do.
      You pay way to much for apple hardware period.
      Keep paying over payinf and keep modding down mac fan boys.
    • ucbrave92, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5knupso, overpriced? i think not. when you purchase a mac not only does it come with a great os but it comes with very useful apps. say my MBP costs me $2k, not only did i get a laptop that even by dell would run about 1600 bucks on hardware alone, I also have iLife included. Now for me to match that software offering on a pc it would put me right back on that same price level of $2k. not to mention that when leopard comes out it will probably run about $129 bucks, how much does XP Pro cost? (i don't mean oem, i am talking retail) yeah, about $300 dollars, and lord knows what vista will cost for the full version. also with os x you don't have the troubles that windows causes. therefore if you look at the full package and think about what you are getting, the mac is a much better deal.
    • Carnil, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1@ucbrave92
      Have you heard about free software? Linux comes also with tons of apps out of the box free of charge, so that dell stays at $1600, and, even better, I can find a much cheaper one because, you know, linux doesn't force me to buy specific hardware...
      Oh, but, of course, delvach considers a single hardware platform a "good thing" in his list, so much for freedom of choice...
    • Dakana, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2- Single hardware & software platform eliminates the need for installing drivers and reduces compatibility issues

      :::::This in turn reduces software and hardware CHOICES.


      - More secure and stable than Windows

      :::::This is another arbitrary statement that's not based in fact. There are more viruses created for Windows because it is the dominant OS in the world. There are more reports of it crashing because more unstable programs are released for it and more people use Windows and in turn report on it than on a Mac.


      - Well-researched UI that assumes an intelligent user who doesn't need 200 "Are you sure..." dialog boxes.

      :::::This is the type of condescending --opinion-- that gets Mac zealots in deep water to begin with. It's always a great idea to insult people's intelligence to get them to see eye-to-eye with you.


      - From the perspective of a cross-browser/platform web developer, IE is the worst browser on the market, and people using it make my life difficult.

      :::::Windows is completely synonymous with IE? Opera, Firefox, Mozilla, Netscape...
  • Bloekie, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8http://www.duggmirror.com/apple/Apple_Leopard_ready_to_pounce/
  • xxdesmus, on 10/12/2007, -43/+16Buried.

    New OS, Same old *****. Apple ready to finally stop sucking, ready to get more users, blah blah blah.

    Nope. Not going to happen as usual.
    • procdaddy, on 10/12/2007, -22/+19open your eyes, its happening.
    • sleepyness, on 10/12/2007, -19/+14@procdaddy

      Not really...

      XP is fine for most people, average joe doesn't need to upgrade his OS every year. Sure it's great that a new revision of OSX comes out every year, but it isn't exactly necessary. In fact, one might say it's annoying.
    • thespace, on 10/12/2007, -8/+11Ya, I wonder if he's ever been to an Apple store
    • thespace, on 10/12/2007, -15/+2That's why there's iLife!!!! LOL!!!
    • xxdesmus, on 10/12/2007, -10/+3@procdaddy

      lol...where?
    • walterd93, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2@sleepy: it's not like you HAVE to upgrade your operating system every year...they just make a new revision(which i think is great) for people who do want it.
    • soopafly, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3"New OS, Same old *****."

      You're talking about Vista right?
  • liquidrums, on 10/12/2007, -16/+1edit.
  • dave74, on 10/12/2007, -10/+9Windows has gained a huge market place into the bussiness and corporate world, and I guess, it will remain as is for a while.
    Final users switching from PC are fast growing everyday. If the gamers communities get into mac, Microsoft is going to be in trouble, even more!
  • belvedere, on 10/12/2007, -10/+13"the damage may well already be irreparable"

    More "Boot Camp" will be the end of Windows nonsense. Linux can already dual boot with Windows, and it hasn't exactly made a dent in the home desktop market. To a typical home user, using Mac OS X still requires buying expensive Mac hardware, even with the new Intel platform, since Apple won't support anything else. Apple just isn't in the same league for overall flexibility in hardware support as Microsoft is, like it or not. No digg.
    • PJBonoVox, on 10/12/2007, -11/+8Couldn't have put it better myself.

      I can't help thinking also that for every user that jumps ship from Windows to Mac, there'll be another two Dell PCs shipped with Windows XP/Vista.

      No digg, for the self-indulgent, sensationalist and self-indulgent blinkered Mac lovers headline.
    • jnnycakes, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1I would guess Linux hasn't made a dent in the but that typical home user doesn't even have a clue what Linux is or what it can offer. It's hard to make a dent in a market like that. With Boot Camp, they've heard of Mac, maybe have seen it or used it. I would say that they are more likely to make the switch now with Mac dual boot machines then they were/are with Linux dual boot machines.
    • nuflux, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Linux hasn't made a dent because most users don't want a "DIY" operating system. They want a seamless experience that works with commercial applications.
    • PJBonoVox, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5"With Boot Camp, they've heard of Mac, maybe have seen it or used it."

      This is unbelievable. You think the average home user even knows of the existance of the Mac? You think the average home user knows anything but Windows? You think they even know what 'dual boot' means?

      Most of them, for christs sake, don't even know what an operating system is. Windows, to them, is the PC.

      Please, stop spouting this ***** in an attempt to create a self fulfilling prophecy. It's never going to happen, you'll always be a minority. Please, just deal with it.
  • estvir, on 10/12/2007, -6/+12What's so special this time ? I remember hearing the same propaganda back when Tiger was released and prior versions (And other products).

    Apple has great products, yes, but even with Vista delays and all the [apparnt] bad press has anyone bailed on MS (And I mean more than a single person or a small group, I'm talking corporations with thousands of pcs.. or even small businesses with 10 or 20) ? Nope.

    Everyone remember the "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ? Sound [somewhat] familiar ?

    Summary: Apple has excellent products and a strong [albeit small] following.. but this WWDC (With Leopard and whatever) isn't going to magically push Apple up unless they make some incredible announcement (Virtualisation.. wait, that was already denied).

    Sorry for being blunt, but it has to be said, pipe dreams aren't really good for anyone.
    • wqwert, on 10/12/2007, -7/+6Apple isn't going after small businesses or corporations. Have you seen any of their marketing? They want be the digital hub for the digital home.
    • belvedere, on 10/12/2007, -14/+5I'll believe the second coming of Apple has arrived when I can custom build a computer to solely run Mac OS X from parts purchased on newegg. Oh, it can theoretically be done (yes, yes, Mac OS X is just BSD), but good luck on your driver hunt. Such a feat will require not just Apple embracing the cloned hardware it has so long shunned, but such compatibility will also require all of the manufacturers of said hardware to embrace Apple and put developer resources into Mac OS X driver development...when they already do so for Windows, which already has the compatibility and user base they're looking for. So where's the incentive?
    • estvir, on 10/12/2007, -6/+7Does that change -anything- in my post ? Nope.

      Replace busines with a family with multiple people using the same computer or whatever example fancies you.

      People aren't switching in large numbers, and [barely] in noticable numbers.

      I saw someone watch those new Apple commercials and they said (Along the lines of) "My PC works with my camera and all my stuff, why do I need this?"
    • ZergyPoo, on 10/12/2007, -4/+10I agree, there is nothing groundbreaking here that will get any significant number of people to switch.

      What people here on Digg don't seem to realize is that Windows XP is not nearly as bad or unstable as Mac users claim it is. It isn't hard to use. Installing hardware and software is simple, and it works with a much broader variety of software and hardware than OSX does.

      Most people see those Mac commercials and think: "but my computer can already do all that stuff."

      There is nothing here that is going to "kill" Microsoft.
    • r0ck3tm4nn, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6To say that Leopard will magically slay the Microsoft dragon is naive. As a multi-platform user (linux server, windows desktop, and a Macbook), I see both OS's as having their strengths. I got a Macbook not because I was "fed up" with Windows but because I wanted a change of pace, and my computer usage didn't dictate using one specific operating system. I'd say this reflects the vast majority of "joe sixpack" home computer users out there. Tiger and Leopard are in no way able to compete in the commercial sector. However, I'm sure there is a market for people who use Windows machines all day at work, and would like nothing better than to use something different at home.
    • 64nDh1, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0ZergyPoo: "What people here on Digg don't seem to realize is that Windows XP is not nearly as bad or unstable as Mac users claim it is."

      What I didn't realise before getting a Mac was how hard it is to go back to XP because, while it's not bad, it is significantly worse than any 10.3+ strain of OS X in most areas. Activation headaches (Windows Advantage), virus concerns, enforced IE integration (Windows Update), no on-the-fly fragmentation prevention, inconsistencies of GUI (i.e. no Menu Bar), program features buried in right-click menus (bad design), no password required for serious changes (modifying System files), difficulties in running as limited access user (much more feasible on OS X), no effective command line on Windows and poorer options for keyboard navigation, backwards compatibility headaches (Windows legacy security headaches, c.f. Windows Meta File (WMF) debacle), Windows slows down over time, OS X hasn't slowed for me in 18 months, and on OS X I can change what features of the OS run: I have Dashboard disabled, Spotlight off, I wonder if I could do this on Vista.

      For those who spend a lot of time on OS X, Windows doesn't make a lot of sense, and it's not enticing. It's a penance to admin my old XP system.
  • AzzX, on 10/12/2007, -10/+12What damage LOL!
    Vista will outsell all versions of OSX in its first week of release!
    Very damaging indeed.
    • Gofel, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8The damage is not in market share but in mind share. Ford sells more sedans than Bugatti, Bentley, Ferrari, and Porsche sell altogether, but that does not mean that every other person does not desire a luxury, high performance car.
    • cyfer2000, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3I can read the damage from your post already.
  • ravenofwinter, on 10/12/2007, -6/+8Irreparable damage?

    Microsoft still has a huge percentage of the market, and the article even says Leopard may include Bootcamp so folks can boot Windows on their Apple's.

    I fail to see the genuine damage. At most, Microsoft has a bit of a black eye from Vista Delays and cutbacks, but while that might matter to some folks, to others, they'll just shrug and say "Does this have anything good for me" ?

    Besides, can you imagine the complaints if Microsoft regularly released new OS versions? Automakers might need to have new models every year, and even computer hardware folks, but the OS? Sure, gradual improvements and upgrades fine, Microsoft has that handled, non-issue, but complete overhauls? I doubt anybody wants it that quickly, especially not in the business world, which is Microsoft's major customer. (At least, not for your standard Desktop PC's, I am aware there are cutting edge enterprise uses, but that's another matter).







    • raindogmx, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6"the damage may well already be irreparable."

      I guess it would be if MacOS were sold separately. Not that I don't like Macs, I do, but MacOS is very expensive now considering you have to buy the PC too. Maybe they're secretly planning to do it?
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2And yet regular releases is just what Microsoft plans going forward - that's part of what the article is saying, quoting Balmer on this very issue.

      If you think about it over about two releases OS X got just as many features as Vista, only by releasing a few features here and there they had time to get them in good shape before release, and since they've been out have been able to fine-tune them rather well. No matter how many developers Microsoft has having tens of millions of people test a feature is always going to be a lot more complete and yield insights you would not have otherwise.
    • AaronTheYoung, on 10/12/2007, -5/+0Microsoft does release a new operating system (every month) -- cleaning up their insecure code -- it's called Windows Critical Updates! Megs and megs of new code is release.
    • lane.montgomery, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2Microsoft has become more like Debian and Apple more like Ubuntu as far as release cycles go.

      It just depends on which model you prefer.
  • gcube9x, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8Why do people get so riled up about something like this? Let people do whatever the f___ they want, if someone wants an expensive system with a pretty OS, let them. If someone wants a cheaper box with a working but lacking OS, let them. If someone wants something ultra-customizeable based on the effort put in, let them.
    • nofxjunkee, on 10/12/2007, -7/+5"if someone wants an expensive system with a pretty OS, let them. If someone wants a cheaper box with a working but lacking OS"

      I understand the first 2 points are about Vista and XP, and the last about *nix, but where does the Mac fit in? ;-) don't take this seriously, i'm semi-trolling.
  • eboy, on 10/12/2007, -13/+7There is no finer computer then a macbook running osx....if you doubt this, then you haven't used one yet....go out and play then return here with your comments....
    Whatever Leopard unveils....it will be stunning and way ahead of the curve....look around...everyone follows Apple....right now, they are the only game in town....
    • Lynn, on 10/12/2007, -11/+9That is your opinion. I perfer Vista.
    • PJBonoVox, on 10/12/2007, -11/+3I've used one extensively, and I couldn't agree with you any less.
    • bepe86, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12I agree, I'll take a OS X or Ubuntu with Gnome and Compiz over Vista any day.

      Mac OS X:
      + (subjective) clean, yet nice interface
      + (subjective) simple to use
      + performant

      - expensive (to get it to work properly, you need Apple hardware)

      Ubuntu w/ Gnome and Compiz
      + free (as in beer and freedom)
      + good performance
      + (subjective) fun to play with

      - unstable, still in beta
      - requires an ATi or nVidia card

      Vista:
      + (subjective) looks good
      + runs almost everything

      - requires 700MB RAM on my PC, which is 1/3 of my 2GB, and then I haven't opened any apps
      - (subjective) I don't like the interface, it looks too messy for me
    • estvir, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Please, Vista doesn't use 700MB of ram (People still believe The Inquirer ?) and as seen by the latest builds (From the RC branch) performance is steadily improving with resource use going down.

      Here's an interesting point, Vista has over HALF the amount of CPU usage for rendering the GUI compared to XP and the lates builds are half of Beta 2's usage.

      Otherwise, what you said is valid. :)
    • bepe86, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@estvir

      The build I ran (can't remember build number, I believe it was beta 2), it used 35% of my RAM, which is 700. Checked it in Task Manager as well. If they've improved that lately, that's great, but that was the situation on the last build I ran :)
  • emeidi, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8"irreparable" - Although this sounds compelling to me (I'm a Mac user), it's far from reality. As long as almost all major businesses run Windows on their client computers, there will be profit for Microsoft - whether they release software in time or not.
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2But what happens when businesses do start getting Macs? It is already happening - execs are more and more demanding Macbooks (as they love laptops), which in turn means that they demand Macs be supported in a company - and once a company adds support for macs that in turn enables teams of workers to ask for macs as well when computer purchases come around.
    • naio21, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"execs are more and more demanding Macbooks (as they love laptops)"

      Can you provide some numbers to back up this assumption?
  • nofxjunkee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I love my Mac, but I think more people will stick to XP till Vista comes out rather than buy a Mac, but I could be wrong. I'm thinking about companies mainly, I don't see them switching. Home users, sure some of them will.
  • MattGilley, on 10/12/2007, -11/+5You Windows users will never understand this. Use Linux, Windows and a Mac for a while and you'll understand more.
    • Lynn, on 10/12/2007, -5/+7I use all 3 and I like Vista. Do you understand now?
    • Angostura, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6As a Mac user, I think you need a slap, you patronizing oik.
    • iSEPIC, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I used all four, and I choose Windows 2003 as a desktop, thanks. (yes, I have two Macs, and I have a few linux boxes too - at home) - NO Macs at work and thousands of linux and windows boxes there, not that anyone cares though.
  • rhrrs2, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Yeah... the reason MicroSteve is so late is because they're trying to figure out how to make Vista not run on a Mac.
    • PJBonoVox, on 10/12/2007, -5/+4Yeah, I'm sure there's loads of people out there wanting to do that.

      "Dude, I just bought a PC and put Vista on it!"

      "OMFGzorz dude, you could have spent $400 more and got a Mac for Vista!"

      "Shut up, retard. Point?"
    • Joey67, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Ummm... yeah... because everyone knows Microsoft wants to sell fewer copies of Vista?
  • maninblac1, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5I'd just like to say, that i don't think microsoft could care less about OSX 10.5. I don't think microsoft could care less, that apple's can run windows.

    Microsoft is a SOFTWARE company. Apple is, well a hardware company, simply put, OSX doesn't run on all PC's. I tried to install it on a HP laptop, yeah, that didn't get me very far. So it doesn't matter what PC you're using, as long as you're using microsoft software, they don't care whether you dual boot, single boot, VMware whatever. Apple makes money from their computers and OS, microsoft makes money from it's software, OS and Office.
    • s0ny, on 10/12/2007, -5/+6Personally, I think your a retard. The simple fact that you cant seem to grasp how a competing operating system affects a "software" company just proves it.

      Regardless of anyones view on the Windows vs OSX debate, you cant deny that with almost every feature shared between the two, Apple has always been first. Apple IS Microsofts R&D department and every great feature they preview today will one day be half-ass copied and thrown into the next version of Windows.

      To All you people who dont think they are scared at all and that Macs arent making any progress in the marketshare category, wake up! Look around college campuses and your friends / family. Personally, since Apple went to Intel processors Ive had 5 extended family members and 4 friends (all of whom previously HATED Macs) purchase Macs, and around 4-5 more are just waiting for the Merom/Conroe systems until they make their purchases.

      You can say Microsoft doesnt care, but Apple is the only TRUE consumer alternative to Windows. (I love linux, but by saying consumer alternative I would not set my Mom/Dad/Grandparents up with a Linux box) And while not making any gains in the corporate market where cheap beige boxes rule, they are making a large gain in the consumer area. Anyone who doesnt see that is either myopic to the truth or needs to get out more.
  • daven1986, on 10/12/2007, -5/+5if osx is so great, why are all you bitches dual booting windows while crying that osx kicks its ass in every way? oh wait maybe you want to play games my bad.

    i tried dual booting linux but it was *****, so it got deleted. if windows is so *****, delete it. osx and linux will never overtake windows until games are made for them, as the user will always have to buy windows to play games - therefore MS will still make money and still be a competitor.

    end of
    • computermatt, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4here's why, some great apps run only in Windows :(, and us mac users want them too, so dual booting gives us the Mac (yay) and Windows (slight boo) in one machine (yay).
    • daven1986, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4exactly, so no matter how great osx is, you still need windows for some software and games. until osx takes more than 50% of the market share, this will always be the case.
    • suomi, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7daven - proof positive that Digg is over-run by 13 year old know-nothings. It is getting to be intolerable - each and ever story ends up with a comments section that looks like a text message war between the kids on the special bus and several million chimps behind keyboards.

      Take for instance "i don't think microsoft could care less about OSX 10.5. I don't think microsoft could care less, that apple's can run windows." from a post higher up.

      Spelling errors I can forgive, we all make them - I make them... But what, in the name of all that is holy, is the ***** that supposed to mean?
    • maninblac1, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3suomi
      i'm not sure if you'r knocking me or complimenting me. I'm just saying, that the article seems to believe that microsoft will suffer from apple's marketing decisions. And i can't see that being the case.
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2You only need to dual boot Windows until you find a Mac app that replaces what the Windows one does - it allows you a slow migration. Plus it lets you run games, for as long a time as you care to until you discover console gaming is a lot less hassle than PC gaming.

      If everyone has a Mac, and the number of people running Windows becomes less and less - then eventually all you need is a Mac and can remove the Windows partition.

      But that is just trying to avoid the obvious fact that being able to run both Windows and Mac apps is better than only being able to run Windows apps. There are a number of applciations exclusive to the Mac that Windows does not have.
    • suomi, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"i'm not sure if you'r knocking me or complimenting me."

      Read the piece of text I quoted and tell me if it makes ANY sense.

      OK. OK. You wrote it and so you probably can't see what is wrong with it... I am 'knocking' you.
  • gajan75, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6I prefer Amiga os
    • Greyarea, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Fah. Poncy graphical user interfaces!

      TRS-DOS all the way :-)
  • ClassicJBC, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@procdaddy

    "that is like using MS Paint as an alternative to Photoshop..."

    I hope you're not referring to Avid. It's only the most popular and most powerful video editing suite in the world, y' know.

    Premiere, while no Final Cut, is not a slouch of a program either, especially the newer releases. I would liken it to using Paint Shop Pro vs. Photoshop.
    • mateo60, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Avid is dying.
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Film schools have all pretty much switched to Final Cut Pro. Most indie movies are done in Final Cut Pro. Avid is just way too expensive for what you get, and a lot of people like the featuresets of Final Cut.

      Avid is still used at the very top end, but I think at this point it would be incorrect to claim it is the most popular video editing applciation.
  • aonghusflynn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5By including Boot camp Apple will help Windows sell more copies, just because it's Dual Boot doesn't mean that you don't need a license for MS. I can't see how this will damage Microsoft at all. Or am I missing something?
  • tdskate, on 10/12/2007, -6/+4The Microsoft Windows Era is due to end in 2 hours, 51 minutes.
    -- http://www.macrumorslive.com/
  • Piggy101, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1msoft biggest worry should not be osx but windows xp and 2000. i don't forsee a widespread adoption of vista anytime soon, and with pc sales going down yearly then less people are going to be getting the OEM vista anytime soon.
    • Lynn, on 10/12/2007, -5/+3PC sales are up 15% over the last 2 years. Stop spreading FUD.
    • ThirdPrize, on 10/12/2007, -6/+2No they are not, they are staying the same.
  • Kking199, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1I don't buy Vista's delay is hurting Microsoft, other than cashflow. Let's start with Windows 3.11 - Win95 was a huge leap and there were compelling reasons to upgrade. Win95 - Win98 another significant leap and again a noticeable improvement. We'll skip ME, since it wasn't even a 'new' version, not to mention it was garbage. Win98 - Win2000/XP. To me the major jump here and the reason why I am mef about Vista is that we finally got a super stable OS.

    I've used every version of Windows from 3.1 up,( I played with Win 2.0 and I laughed.) Every version up to Win2000/XP I was always having to 'manage' it, constantly tweak it, coax it, and ususually reinstall it once a year!! That all ended with 2000/XP. I'm not having to manage Windows anymore, it works, it's stable, end of story.

    I don't buy that Vista will be more secure than 2000/XP, I don't think that's a knock against Vista it's just the reality of computers and software, there will always be ways to crack OS's. I'm sure MS will use Security as a MAJOR selling point, and they'll also pull the runs on Vista only stunt, like we've seen with recent games produced by MS that 'say' they only run on XP. I made a conscious decision not to buy AoE III becasue of that crap.

    So I have a very stable OS that works great, all my software works fine on it. Why do I want to spend what, $100+??, to upgrade my OS that oh btw, is going to demand significantly more Ram and system resources?!!?

    It will be interesting to see how Vista sells...
    • Greyarea, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"I don't buy that Vista will be more secure than 2000/XP, I don't think that's a knock against Vista it's just the reality of computers and software, there will always be ways to crack OS's."

      For a good explanation of why Vista is going to be a security nightmare download this week's Security Now podcast (episode 51). Short version: Vista has a brand new, written-from-scratch network stack. This is a Very Bad Thing.
  • Topher06, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8Again and again, each revision of OSX is hailed as a Windows killer and Microsoft will not recover from its release?

    Snicker, giggle, ROFLOL.

    Sorry, but people have been predicting Apple's dominance in the computer industry for 30 years, and they are unsubstantiated pipe dreams.

    Apple will happily continue its 5% dominance in a niche market with Leopard. Despite its advanced features, security, reliability and performance, OSX 10.5 will not initiate a trend for PC uers to switch to Mac's.

    Simply put, the reason why Apple has never succeeded in getting more then 5% of the market it that their OS is tied to their hardware, and as long as Apple makes their hardware either too expensive (PowerMac's, PowerBooks, Mac Pro's MacBook Pros, etc), or too specialized (iMac and Mac Mini), this will not get PC users to switch from a platform that allows for ample choice and cheap configurations. You can buy a decent PC for around $300, and it outperforms a MacMini which is over two times more expensive and has limited upgrade potential.

    Apple needs to swallow a little bit of their pride and release a Mac that is basically their answer to the beige box PC. A computer with lots of choice in hardware configurations and price ranges. Start this "beige box" Mac at around $300 for a basic configuration, and then allow the user to configure it all the way up to a $3000 monster if they want. Compete directly against every configuration that Dell offers basically. That is, if Apple TRUELY wants to become a dominant player in the computer market. Nothing says they have wanted to in their entire 30 years.

    Leopard combined with hardware that can run Windows might give Apple a few extra percentage marks in the total world market, but then that is only people people want a fancy and overpriced PC rather then getting a Mac because it runs Leopard. Few home PC users will want to run Windows in virtualization mode because fo all accounts, gaming will still suffer huge performance hits in that configuration. Dual booting a Mac into Windows will be more ideal, but then, I have already seen a person user their MacBook pro almost exclusively as a Windows workstation, he dabbles in OS X when he wants to load some photos up or do some movie editing in iLife, thats about it. This is not a WIN for Apple, but bascially the PC market saying that they would prefer fancier computer enclosures to run Windows. Apple will become an OEM PC maker like Dell in this case, albiet with a greater attention to detail.

    Apple's other biggest flaw besides their arrogance in assuming they know that the market wants in a computer ( re, after 30 years, they still haven't created a computer that the market wants as bad as an iPod ), is their continuos need to slam PC users for their choice in OS and computer. I mean, Apple's entire Ad campaign over the last few decades has been to tell PC users that essentially their OS sucks and their PC suck, so switch to a Mac. Apple has been a little more tactful then most of the Apple fanboy's comments, but that is essentially the case. If your an underdog, trying to convert an very well established installed user base to your product, and you tell billions of people that their choice in product is stupid and sucks, how many people are going to say "Yeah, I am an idiot, let me buy a Mac!" Apple isn't competing in a market where a person that doesnt have a computer is looking at a PC and Mac on the store shelf and needs to figure out which one to buy, they are competing in a market where everyone has a PC, and they need to convince the market that they should invest money and time converting to a Mac. Telling the user base they are stupid is never a good advertising campaign.

    It is amazing how these grand statements are made every time Apple is about to roll out a product, that Microsoft should cower while and new version of OS X or a new Mac will overrun the market and dominate it and cause Microsoft to loose their foothold in this computer market. Once Apple releases their new OS and new hardware and the initial super-hype about Apple plays itself out in the news, at the end of it all, Apple will still have 5% of the computer market because they don't have a clue as to what PC users want.

    Apple's ignorance is only matched by their arrogance in this market. They have all the right components to make a computer that will dominate the market, yet choose to either overprice them or make them too limiting and specialized to initiate that trend, and this will never inspire change from a market ruled by $299 Dell computers. Its not about which hardware/software platform is superior (that is an arrogant pursuit) its about which hardware/software combination is cheap enough to do everything the end user needs to do.
    • maninblac1, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5That's incredibly insightful. Yet a bit long-winded. But too sum it up, negative ad campain, overpriced equipment, and lack of upgradability.
    • JayClark, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Actually, more people have been predicting Apple's death than its dominance. Hasn't happened yet. Also, Apple was the dominant player until the early 90s, so it's only been about fifteen years that they've been in second. I suppose the fact would get in the way of your rant though, sorry

      You know, there's a simple way to ease your mind and end this terrible suffering that Apple is obviously causing you: Don't buy a Mac, be happy using what you have now. You claim to be happy using it, and confident in your choice, but then why go to this kind of trouble convincing other that they are wrong?

      In the end though, it comes down to personal choice. How sad a human being are you if you feel the need to rag on people who choose to use a different OS that you? How empty must your own life be to expend this kind of energy trying to convince people that your opinions are correct?
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2You are assuming people have "chosen" Windows. The reason the switch campains work and do not reflect negativley on WIndows owners today is becuase until recently, really you did not have a choice - you had to buy Windows because that is what work used or you needed this or that application.

      Now that you can run any Windows app on a Mac, you catually do have a choice - and Apple is just pointing that out.

      As for people predicting Apple dominance for 30 years - most of that time was spent predicting they were dead, not ascending.

      As for gaming, you might have noticed these things called "consoles" - with the next gen they are going to move more into taking over the role PC's played for gaming. After all, the 360 is getting a lot of titles before the PC even sees them now...
    • nickiank, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"Sorry, but people have been predicting Apple's dominance in the computer industry for 30 years, and they are unsubstantiated pipe dreams."

      Well, they actually *were* pretty damn dominant in the home and education markets between the late seventies and the mid-eighties, before the internal conflicts between the Apple II and Mac teams started happening. Apple's smart in that they seem to have gotten the platform-shift dance down pat, because few are crying foul over architecture abandonment like they did then.

      Now, if they could just run some advertisements that aren't smarmy and stop alienating potential customers, stop contracting with sweatshops, and document the specs of their platform better, they'd meed the needs of a lot more people. Not *mine*, you know, but a lot of people.
    • nickiank, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1"In the end though, it comes down to personal choice. How sad a human being are you if you feel the need to rag on people who choose to use a different OS that you? How empty must your own life be to expend this kind of energy trying to convince people that your opinions are correct?"

      How sad a company that, with universally acclaimed products and software, results to below-the-belt jabs at other platforms in their advertising materials? How morally unscrupulous must they be to resort to ragging on other platforms, when in all likelihood merely talking about the merits of their own gear would get them more sales?

      Face it, matey: a lot of people don't like Apple simply because the company, despite doing generally brilliant things, acts like a snobby bastard 95% of the time. If they want to capture a hell of a lot more marketshare, they'd abandon this approach. I'm convinced they're still wanting to be a niche player and thrive on return business and that small, fanatical contingent of their userbase who needs every thing emblazoned with their logo.
    • jesusg, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Topher06.

      Apple is never touted OSX as the Windows killer. As Steve J. said "pc wars are over and MS won it". However OSX is far superior and more stable and its features have been copied by MS (for example spotlight and widgets - oh sorry I meant gagdets which is what MS calls it-Yup there is innovation from MS again).

      There are 114K viruses in the MS Windows platform (and counting). This is a fact. People are sick of this. Maybe you are never been impacted by this but a ton of people have. People don't want to deal with MS security patch # 567, anti-virus/spyware updates. The young crowd and these people are the folks that Apple is targeting and if they can get a decent percentage of them Apple and its stockholders will be happy. These folks want a rock solid OS and hardware that not only performs well but it is pleasing to look at. They want to get work done. Yes maybe you and others don't care about the looks but I can tell you that a lot of people do. I have owned several Win PCs and macs and people that come over touch my macs and don't want to put them down. Why do you think people love their macs and love it to share it witht the world? When was the last time you heard someone said "I love my Dell"?

      Apple isn't targeting 50 year old Windows accountants and bottom feeders that want to buy a Dell POS for $300. Trust me there is no money to be made in $300 pc. These customers over long term become a drain. And while most consumers don't rely on total cost of ownership to make tech purchases I can guarantee you that by the time you add great looking hardware, a great os, better user experience, less crashes, less viruses, and iLife you will see that Apples cost about the same,

      Apple knows this and while they may never top Dell in say market share Apple knows its market and it continue to grow and be a very profitable company with the best margins in the computer biz. Companies have been doing this for years. Look at BMW, Victoria Secret, Whole Foods and others.

      You can't compare the iPod with the mac biz. They are separate markets and products. The mac platform is complex and requires heavy investment from the company and it is a more difficult decision for consumers to make. The iPod is just a music player (easy decision to make) and and when you look at pricing the iPod certainly isn't the cheapest but it sells well.

      Yout talk about games. While virtualization takes a performance hit I believe most Apple users don't care about gaming. Those that do go out and get gaming consoles. Regardless there is no shortage of games for the mac. It just so happens that there are more games on the PC. Also you must remember the target market. Apple/Parallels folks are offering boot camp/Paralles to those folks that may need to run an ocassional Win only app not 100% of all windows ussers. If more than 50% of your apps are win only you should stick with a Win PC and Apple knows this.

      I do agree with you on the ads. Apple could tone it down a bit. I wouldn't make of fun of people that I'm trying to target.

      Lynn: Maybe you should stop spreading FUD. 15% PC growth. Apple has been growing at a higher percentage and that 15% you have to split it between Dell, HP, Lenovo, Acer, Gateway, and thousands of mom and pop PC clones (not much growth now is there?). Apple's application support continues to grow as well as the attendance to its development conferences

      And all of this is coming from someone who was a Windows user for 15 years with multiple notebooks and desktops, used to install Windows and sold Windows corporate apps for a living.
    • JayClark, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ nickiank

      That's probably true, to a point. It's worth pointing out that many of us, despite being Mac users, don't care for the new ads for exactly that reason. Personally, I couldn't care less how they advertise themselves, except in how it affects their sales.

      Also, I wouldn't mind if they stay a niche player. They're already one of the most profitable computer makers around, so they're not going anywhere, and the constant pressure of being a small player forces them to make their products better and more universally compatible, both good things from where I'm sitting.
    • cygnusx, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1@jesusg: However OSX is far superior and more stable and its features have been copied by MS (for example spotlight and widgets - oh sorry I meant gagdets which is what MS calls it-Yup there is innovation from MS again).

      Windows 98 and NT4 had DHTML desktop widgets. It's called Active Desktop and *still* there on 2000 and XP. Back in '98 my NT4 desktop had an SVG analog clock on it, along with a DHTML photoframe based on IE's Transitions behavior.

      So give the "Apple invented desktop widgets" rah-rahs a rest, please? It's not like desktop widgets are the epitome of an operating system's features, anyway. Most folk who use computers for Real Work(tm) don't use 'em -- it hardly takes much time to pull out a browser and hit a bookmark/search for whatever you're looking for. The biggest boosters of widgets seem to be people who have endless amounts of time tweaking their OS shell and pimping out their desktop.
  • ThirdPrize, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I am going to buy a Mac and install vista on it. Whose side am I on then?
    • ThirdPrize, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1It could happen, and Jobs could have shares in a pig based airline.
    • Greyarea, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1ThirdPrize: you've not heard of Boot Camp, then?
  • CriticalImpact, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2While yes OS X is a formidable OS and I would use it assuming I didnt have to buy Mac specific hardware(i like building my own, getting a conroe 2+7950GX2), it doesnt change the fact that Windows is equally as good assuming you treat it right. I dont have full blown statistics but amount of people using windows is around 90% or more(please correct me) so obviously the amount of virus's and spyware being designed for windows is going to increase because of this. I mean why would a spyware manafacturer make spyware for something not that many people use, they do it because they can hit the weakest people who use windows.

    Windows is inherenitly insecure BUT assuming you set it up correctly you can run with just a router, no virus protection or a firewall and not destroy your computer. Now essentialy if everyone switched to Mac im sure there'd be more viruses and spyware that would hit Mac but not everyone is going to switch over and just because Lepoard adds in a couple of new features doesnt mean that everyone is going to shell out money to get a competly new computer. Thats the main critisism i have of Macs, the fact that you have to pay for a new computer on the whole, you may be able to upgrade the ram or hard disk but you cant upgrade any of the main components.

    The major reason I use windows is because I have to if I want to play games without having to shell out hundreds if not thousands of dollars just to use OS X, its really pointless for people with good rigs already and unless Apple release a version of OS X that supports third party computers I dont see how they have a chance of ever over taking microsoft. Digg me down if you want, but this is my opinon, im not a fan of any OS, windows has flaws i'll admit but its the most stable thing that plays the games I want, does the things I need and works without crashing. If your windows crashes its mainly because of user error or hardware failure.
  • stewiesdeuce, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4damage may well already be irreparable? That's just plain silly. MS is not going away, and Apple is *NO* real threat to MS. Apple, for the most part, is proprietary. Yes, the OS is Unix and runs all sorts of fun stuff now, but the hardware is locked, and you pay up to 100% more than a comparable PC based machine.

    Hey Steve Jobs.. instead of those cheezy and loaded with inaccuracies, "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" Ads, sell your products at a MUCH more competitive rate?? I think people will buy on price more than "hey, look, i'm pretty and expensive".
    • maninblac1, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6And he's right folks, the home user would rather buy a dell than a mac.
    • redxii, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2The damage from your wallet will be irreparable.

      Only Linux can slay Windows because it is not bound by a single architecture, a specific brand of motherboard, and a specific model specially made for just one company.
    • superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1They are addressing cost, the basic Macbnook is cheaper than the same laptop from Dell. The higher end stuff does see a little markup but you also get more advanced features.

      Cost has not been an issue for buying a Mac for some time now.
  • brettshow, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3I truly believe one of the advantages that APPLE has today, and the next year is to convert. Like everyone knows, Apple has about 4-5% market share, depending on who you speak to. Compared to Windows with 90 something %. Apple is in a very unique position because if they can convince only 4% to switch to Mac, they have doubled their market share. That is amazing for a company to do. I think some of you are right, that Microsoft doesn't care about Leopard, they are totally focused on Vista, but a disadvantage that they have is they are not a Hardware company. Apple makes both, so they know how it will run from day one, not like MS where they release an OS for TONS of hardware, and there is always some HOOPLA. Apple has always had a following of loyal users, even when they were the biggest market share, and now you are starting to see that come back, slowly but steadily and I know windows and MS has never had a following like Apple has had. I cannot wait to see what Leopard has to offer, hopefully not just a few app upgrades.
    • maninblac1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2They know how it will run, it's kind of interesting, when i installed OSX, i spent 15 min waiting for, digital camera, printer and scanner drivers to install. They had to have hundreds of these. I mean give me a break!

      How about some video drivers, or sound drivers, a critical system component like video and sound. I can do without camers and scanners and what not. That's just poor support for alterior hardware, their single greatest flaw.

      And MS does have a cult following. Business and office productivity. The market will be loyal to Office for at least another 5 years, until something truly greater comes along.
  • jibijibi, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1I read the tile and I know this was going to be like this. From IRC, to forums and now to sites like digg. Can it ever be a good argument. We look like babies telling each other that our mom is better than your mom.
    For example I read 2 comments up and I see "PC sales are up 15% over the last 2 years. Stop spreading FUD." Where did you find this fact? How do you know that PC sales were up 15%? Are you saying that for 100 PC sold in 2004 now they are selling 115. That's not much. Does it really matter what Operating system is better? If it does matter why couldn't anyone write a smart and empirical comment.
    Moreover, the article was not about OS X being better than Windows. It is pointing out that after Apple moved to Intel it can offer dual boot to Windows. Dual boot machines may be (in the future) more attractive to home users because they can take work home and use windows if they have to. It states that Apple is not ready for the business world yet. And that's an open statement. So what's the big deal about Photoshop / MS Paint?
  • nixfu, on 10/12/2007, -7/+5



    HAHA... "Welcome to Vista 2.0"

    http://static.flickr.com/74/207241438_7c0f89412d_b.jpg



    • i64X, on 10/12/2007, -5/+4Jobs is probably the most smug bastard on Earth.

      Before seeing that I was contemplating a Macbook. Not anymore.
    • DaffyDuck, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Yeah, right. A sign you saw on the internet changes your $1500+ purchasing decision.
  • nixfu, on 10/12/2007, -5/+5I like this banner hanging at the conference center:

    "MacOS X Lepoard... Introducing Vista 2.0"..... so true.

    http://static.flickr.com/74/207241438_7c0f89412d_b.jpg


    I'm thinking desktop background potential here...


    /damn digg update flakiness.
  • dpcamp, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4"the damage may well already be irreparable"

    yeah... because Apple is going to take that much of a bite out of Microsoft's market share by releasinging an OS 4-6 monthes before MS does.

    1)It's been done probably 15(i'm exaggerating before you down digg me) times since XP has been released and

    2) we all know where Microsoft will always hold there place. The workplace.
    • saleens281, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Maybe not *ALWAYS* but they definitely aren't stepping down anytime soon. I'm really sick of fanboi's saying that windows is going down. I think there must be 20 posts a week from mac and linux zealots alike. Guess what guys, you've been saying it for well over 10 years now and it still hasn't happened. Maybe just *MAYBE* Microsoft is getting the job done. It doesn't matter if you agree with HOW they're getting it done, they're still getting it done.

      *the year of the linux desktop*

      and

      *apples can now own the workplace*

      just isn't happening.
  • bruce89, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Ach, 6 months seems long between OS's for me - Ubuntu.
  • Magadass, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Finally an author that actually gets it, OSX will never have an adoption in the workforce or to the corporate entity and specifically never in the federal arena, they buy very low cost machines and get an insane deal from Microsoft, not to mention nearly 90% of all the government applications are written for Windows and these are highly specialized very expensive applications. With the largest portion of American money going toward federal projects I dont see the adaptation of Window changing anytime soon, especially since there is such a large employment rate for federal employees, yes you can take your work home and work on it with a Mac but spending 8 hours a day using Windows might give you a bit more familiarity with that system.

    I agree OSX is a VERY good choice for the Home user and perhaps smaller businesses if they are willing to incur the expense. OSX is a nice OS and I use it all the time but my main computer is still Windows, I am a developer and I enjoy developing for Windows. At this particular time frame I dont see Linux, OSX or Windows excelling in any area, Apple will always be lacking in software, especially games including Linux. DirectX is one of the best technologies Microsoft has ever created and it holds a very strong appreciation to game developers compared against OpenGL and others. If Apple was to some how create an emulation layer between DirectX so that DirectX games could run on OSX without performance penalty I think they would win a MASSIVE amount of users.
    • Antialias, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1For the federal market, I hear the NSA, NASA, and a few other government agencies use a lot of Macs. Of course that is only a small minority of Government purchases.

      As for gaming, TransGaming just released something just like you were saying, Cedega allows developers to easily port their windows games to run naively on osx. I haven't read enough about it to be sure it supports directX though. I imagine it would since openGL games can already be ported without too much trouble, at least compared to DirectX games.
  • pixelpimp, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2I think Apple should create a Linux Division and support a lot of Apple software to work with Linux (Quicktime, iLife etc.) Since Apple will never break the OS from there Hardware (Again); I think to keep driving nails into Microsoft they need a dual approach. There OS X Leopard for the consumer and a Linux Business side attack.
  • DrivinWest, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Computers are tools. Use the tool that works best for you. For me, that's mostly OS X. For you that might be YellowTab Zeta or SkyOS. Whatever. The fact that people get so bent out of shape over an operating system is ABSURD. It's geek bench racing; that's it and that's all.
  • srodolff, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3OK. Reality Check.

    After all this time it should be obvious that anything that Apple releases will have the same effect to Microsoft as a flea on a elephant's butt.

    Apple has apple followers and Microsoft has microsoft followers......and Apple still has a single digit market share.

    Anything else is wishful thinking.
    • DigitalOmnivore, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3If anything this release may help microsoft...you need a legit copy of windows to run boot camp.

      I see Apple hurting Dell and other hardware manufactures more than Microsoft.
  • DrivinWest, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1"Apple will always be lacking in software"

    Since I started using OS X I've never been at a loss for (free/pay) software. On the contrary, I've been pleased that I'm virtually guaranteed that whichever Mac OS X app I pick I can expect it to be powerful, intuitive, stable and aesthetically pleasing. Of all, the last matters the least but it certainly doesn't hurt, especially considering how many otherwise great apps on Linux and Windows apps look like they were ported from Windows 3.1 (at best).

    So yes, there may be fewer choices for OS X, but you can guarantee that for every need there is an app and every app lives up to certain expectations that you come to like as a Mac user.

    www.pure-mac.com

    /not a fanboy. See my above "tool" post.
    //uses the OS that best suits the task to be done
    • DigitalOmnivore, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2lol safari is awful.
    • ThirdPrize, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2OO, Gimp and FF all "aesthetically pleasing"? Not unless you go for the, couple of versions behind, couple of features missing, Aqua port. I was quite amazed how bad much of the big OS software for the Mac looked. And I still got a MacBook.
    • srodolff, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1>>>I've been pleased that I'm virtually guaranteed that whichever Mac OS X app I pick I can expect it to be powerful, intuitive, stable and aesthetically pleasing.

      You forgot one very important aspect......"Compatible"!

      That is the single leading reason why the Mac is not adopted in greater numbers.
  • Joey67, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0Sigh... here we go again... I really should just save this someplace so I don't have to type it out each time one of these OS X vs. Windows threads pops up:

    1) If you like Windows, use Windows
    2) If you like OS X, use OS X
    3) If you like [insert Linux flavor here], use Linux

    Short, sweet, simple, and civilized. Being able to run games does not make an OS a good OS. It may make it more popular, but it has no bearing whatsoever on the quality. If you want to play the latest games, run them on Windows... that's pretty much your only choice. Windows has lots of great applications. If you use FireFox, you'll find that you almost never have issues with adware... and some common sense will keep you free of viruses. OS X is a completely capable OS as well. The "feel" of OS X is totally different than Windows. Sometimes it's just nice to have a change. The one thing I will say is that most people that use OS X have used Windows... most people that use Windows have not tried OS X (or Linux, or Solaris, or BeOS, or OS 2/Warp, etc). There's absolutely nothing wrong with that... if you like Coke, you never have to try Pepsi. BUT... just because you don't like something, or worse yet, have never tried it, don't start talking down to people who are completely competent. People who bash Mac users for no reason are just as bad as Mac users who bash Windows users. Even if you're a Mac user who has spent years working with Windows and felt a "revelation" the first time you used a Mac... that doesn't mean that everyone is going to feel the same way... or that they should. An OS is a tool. You use the tool that best fits your needs. NO tool does everything. My reason for using a Mac is because it gives me the opportunity to use more "tools". I can run OS X and Windows. Most computer users will never upgrade their OS. Here on Digg, you get a more techy crowd... but the average user is going to use whatever OS came with their computer until the day they get rid of it.

    So quit with the bickering. Macs aren't gay, they're not for "noobs". Windows computers aren't boring and incapable or running properly out of the box (as Apple's commercials would lead you to believe)... for the most part, Windows does "just work" as well.
  • ThirdPrize, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2How old is OSX? Leopard is just a service pack (4th or 5th?) with a few new features added. Its not a new OS, its just a bit of an update. OSXI will be equivalent to Vista.
    • Greyarea, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Frankly, from what I've seen of Vista (and yes I've had it installed for a while) it doesn't even compare well to 10.4, much less 10.5.
  • fbriggs, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2"OSXI will be equivelent to Vista" - ThirdPrize

    Don't make me laugh. Vista will never be equivelent to any current version of Mac OS X. Right now, Mac OS X is at least 5 years ahead of Vista. By the time OSXI comes out, it will be 10 years ahead.
    • Lynn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2In your opinion. Opinion is NOT fact.
    • ThirdPrize, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I just meant that the jump from XP to Vista will be the same as OS9 to OSX and not just some point release.
  • Drakeguild, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I am looking forward to see what new features are in Leopard. The Finder, to me feels dated at times, so no doubt that will get revamped. I am also really looking forward to see what will happen with some of my favorite programs like iChat. Hotmail and Yahoo support would be great. Using Jabber restricts me to not being able to send or receive files, which sucks.
  • heydigital, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4At least Microsoft does not charge for their service packs.
    • Greyarea, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Neither does Apple. Service packs on the Mac take the form 10.4.x and are delivered freely over the Software Update facility.
  • gregpc, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I've been using various systems for since the early 80s - mostly DOS or Windows. I got a MacBook Pro in April. I bring my MBP to work. I also have a generic HP laptop on my desk. My work consists of reading, writing, editing, browsing, emailing, IMing, calculating, etc. Guess which system I use more? The other day I needed to do a quick video for a new business pitch. Guess which system I used for that.

    The fact of the matter is that there are plenty of standout features of OSX - things like Garageband and iMovie - can someone point out the out-of-box equivalents for Windows? Has essentially switching to OSX at work caused me any hardship? Nope. With the exception of our time and billing system (which I could run in Parallels if I wanted to) there is no need from me to use the Windows system at all.

    Do I think that Leopard is going to hurt Vista? Probably not; but what it demonstrates does - that there is room on the corporate desktop for alternatives to Microsoft. Linux and open source are also chipping away. I mentioned a discussion I had with a senior editor at Forbes in another thread a while ago. He told me about a major company that we've all heard of that faced a challenge. They have 15,000 employees and another 100,000 seasonal employees. The 15,000 are on Exchange. The 100,000 didn't get email because it was prohibitive. Soon, thanks to Zimbra, they will.

    If there are credible, available, affordable, workable and feature-rich alternatives to Microsoft, why wouldn't they begin finding their way into the enterprise? At the end of the day, virtually every business in America has one goal: to make money. You can make money by getting more OR by spending less. Microsoft might offer software that helps on the getting more side of the equation but they hardly do on the spending less.

    If you're a CIO at a mid-sized company with a thousand PCs that will need to be upgraded in order to run Vista, do you make the switch? Or do you think, I can stick with XP and start looking at some open source alternatives that could save a ton of money and make me look like a hero.

    The fact of the matter is that the Windows monoculture is slipping away. It isn't going to be replaced by Leopard or any other single OS or environment. Instead - thanks in part to wider choice in applications and new thinking from IT pros entering the workforce - a more diverse, productive and economical landscape is likely.
  • OrangeTide, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1You mean "there will never be another five year delay between operating systems" after this last time. Unless Vista is going to make it before October, I think the 5 years at up. And if you enjoy rounding up fractional years, they are already too late.

    Microsoft should learn from Apple. Release a slightly improved version of their OS every 18-24 months, and charge people another $130 for it.
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